View Poll Results: Should Corproations have "personhood" rights?

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  • Yes, corporations are just like a person

    18 18.18%
  • No, corporations are not just like a person

    81 81.82%
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Thread: Corporate Personhood

  1. #491
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by NoJingoLingo View Post
    You keep saying it without any proof. The first amendment protects the rights of the people just like all the rest of the Constitution. That's what the BoR is, protection of the rights of the people from the government. It specifically mentions two other ideals, religion and the press.
    I am curious.

    If you, NoJingoLingo (or whatever your real name is), were part of writing a new constitution for the USA, what type of free speech protections would you place in it?

    Screw what the founders think, would think, or whatever, what would YOU do?
    Education.

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  2. #492
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    And how would that be enforced?

    Again, you can't just make broad pronouncements about what sounds cool if you don't understand how campaign finance has failed so miserably over the past 4 decades.
    I think it would be quite easy to change the system if there was the will to do it.

    But why would members of either party vote for something that might undermine their power when the people in this country are too thoroughly indoctrinated to notice that their representatives are not representing their interests.

  3. #493
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    I think it would be quite easy to change the system if there was the will to do it.
    How? Throw out some proposals. I've seen a lot of rhetoric but absolutely no concrete ideas.

    But why would members of either party vote for something that might undermine their power when the people in this country are too thoroughly indoctrinated to notice that their representatives are not representing their interests..
    So why did they vote for the creation of the FEC in the first place? Or the 91 restrictions? Or BRCA?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

  4. #494
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    But why would members of either party vote for something that might undermine their power when the people in this country are too thoroughly indoctrinated to notice that their representatives are not representing their interests.
    They're indoctrinated? So you need to save them from themselves? Do you realize just how arrogant and scary that is?

  5. #495
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    They're indoctrinated? So you need to save them from themselves? Do you realize just how arrogant and scary that is?
    Not at all. It is fanciful or naive to assume that you can have some voices carry a megaphone while contrary voices are able to whisper, only, and expect voters to hear a diversity of views and form informed decisions. Add to the outsized influence of well heeled interest groups is the fact that the media has been allowed to concentrate into ever fewer large corporate hands. (and Clinton got that ball rolling) If not for the internet, the situation would be quite hopeless.

    Are you asserting that the mere ability to put a mark on a ballot proves that people have had the fullness of informed choice for representation?

  6. #496
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    Not at all. It is fanciful or naive to assume that you can have some voices carry a megaphone while contrary voices are able to whisper, only, and expect voters to hear a diversity of views and form informed decisions.
    You can speak all you want. You aren't forced to whisper. The analogy is silly.

    You want to ration speech. The First Amendment doesn't allow that.

    Are you asserting that the mere ability to put a mark on a ballot proves that people have had the fullness of informed choice for representation?
    Dear God - do you listen to yourself before you post? You think you need to fix what the voters see and hear because they don't get the information you think they need?

    This is exactly the kind of thinking that the First Amendment is designed to prevent.

  7. #497
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Correct. People who want to be the arbiters of what's "fair" speech and what's not are themselves hostile to actual free speech.

    Never mind that it's incumbent upon each and every citizen to keep themselves well-informed.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  8. #498
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by NoJingoLingo View Post
    What is there to wonder about? The Constitution was written for the people of the United States. Some might even go so far as to say it was written for the Citizens of the United States. Nothing in the Constitution mentions corporations while it does specifically name religion, the people, and the Press. All of those are named in the 1st amendment. There is also the word "naturalized citizen" and person.

    The word "people" can be found 8 times, the word "person" 12 times, but not one mention of corporations. Therefore, in our corporatocracy, the SCOTUS has given rights to corporations that the Constitution shows no intent to cover.

    The argument opponents of this make are - it doesn't not say corporations can't be considered people - and - The SCOTUS has given corporations some of those rights which proves the Constitution meant to cover them.
    The idea of the corporation did not exist in the late 18th century. It's an invention of the mid-to-late 19th century. They did have what were called "combinations" of various kinds that involved both capital and labor (what today have developed into corporations and labor unions). It's interesting that the the people at the time of writing the Constitution, in both North America and Britain, eyed these combinations with suspicion, since they used their advantages to enrich small groups of people at the expense of the common weal.

  9. #499
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Correct. People who want to be the arbiters of what's "fair" speech and what's not are themselves hostile to actual free speech.

    Never mind that it's incumbent upon each and every citizen to keep themselves well-informed.
    Oh nonsense. I made it quite clear that I am talking about quantity not type of advertisements ("speech" if you can really call it that). We are talking about drowning the T.V. viewing audience with advertisements representing one point of view- the point of view of corporations.

  10. #500
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Cassandra View Post
    Oh nonsense. I made it quite clear that I am talking about quantity not type of advertisements ("speech" if you can really call it that). We are talking about drowning the T.V. viewing audience with advertisements representing one point of view- the point of view of corporations.
    And as evidence has shown, corporations are absolutely uniform in their views and would never end up competing against each other for space, like they do already.

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