View Poll Results: Should Corproations have "personhood" rights?

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  • Yes, corporations are just like a person

    18 18.18%
  • No, corporations are not just like a person

    81 81.82%
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Thread: Corporate Personhood

  1. #141
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    Exclamation Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    ok, i have to repeat this in another post because its so important.

    for anyone to say that someone's right to express their opinion in some way (like donating money to a campaign) needs to be upheld, you need to supply a reason why that right must be upheld.

    all i am hearing is that the first amendment says that, but you need to ask yourselves why freedom of speech is so important at this instance.
    Aparently, you don't understand or appreciate a key word used in your observation.

    The onus isn't upon the "free" to justify their right to express their views.

    The onus is on those who would seek to limit or to take that right away to explain THEIR justifications for doing so.

  2. #142
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    yeah, and the problem is that most people do not want interests with large amounts of money to have too much influence over how we vote.
    Listen to yourself talk for a minute.

    If you don't want them to have influence over you, don't let them. You have the choice.

    If you are a robot who just votes for whoever someone else tells you to, then do us all a favor and stay home on election day.

  3. #143
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Why don't we just vote for the best candidate on the ballad, and keep money out of it.
    "Don't be particular bout nothin, but the company you keep"

  4. #144
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    The conflict that you have would be avoided IF NO organization could donate as much money as they wanted to a campaign.
    That's already true.

    Corporations are still forbidden from donating ANY money from their corporate treasuries to a campaign. Do you understand that?

    This case simply says they can spend money to directly express their views about politics or elections.

    An environment that outlaws unlimited contributions from the NRA, GOA and Soros is better then one that allows full donations from all of them.
    No, more speech is better than less. A place where everyone is forbidden from speaking isn't a democracy.

  5. #145
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I shouldn't be able to rent a car to drive door to door to talk about a candidate that I like? I shouldn't be able to use a stamp to mail a letter to a paper about a candidate I like? I shouldn't be able to buy some chips to feed people who come to an event I'm hosting to talk about a candidate I like? I shouldn't be able to take out an ad in the local paper urging people to vote for a candidate I like?
    Everyone who thinks money has nothing to do with speech needs to think about that next time their ISP bill comes due.

  6. #146
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    Thumbs up Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Listen to yourself talk for a minute.

    If you don't want them to have influence over you, don't let them. You have the choice.

    If you are a robot who just votes for whoever someone else tells you to, then do us all a favor and stay home on election day.
    What is even more compelling than that (to me) is the notion that law makers have every right to make laws affecting corporations, how they are taxed, how much, how they can use resources, hire, fire and what benefits they can provide (bonuses),.... But that a corporation should NOT have the same right that a 'person' would have to "speak" about it.

    It's lunacy.

  7. #147
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I shouldn't be able to rent a car to drive door to door to talk about a candidate that I like? I shouldn't be able to use a stamp to mail a letter to a paper about a candidate I like? I shouldn't be able to buy some chips to feed people who come to an event I'm hosting to talk about a candidate I like? I shouldn't be able to take out an ad in the local paper urging people to vote for a candidate I like?
    yeah all of that is fine, except for the last one of course though.

    you can have any even that you want about a candidate on your tv show, as long as the entire television show doesn't have one goal of promoting a candidate or political party.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Aparently, you don't understand or appreciate a key word used in your observation.

    The onus isn't upon the "free" to justify their right to express their views.

    The onus is on those who would seek to limit or to take that right away to explain THEIR justifications for doing so.
    You are right, and the burdon that must be overcame by the government is if someone is using money in an unregulated way to promote a candidate.

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    Listen to yourself talk for a minute.

    If you don't want them to have influence over you, don't let them. You have the choice.

    If you are a robot who just votes for whoever someone else tells you to, then do us all a favor and stay home on election day.
    Obviously people have a choice who they will vote for.

    but statistically, if you throw alot of money advertising for a candidate, many more people will support them. Individuals are individuals, but we all have actions that statistically are promoted by certain causes.



    all of you seem to be arguing against ANY regulations on campaign contributions. That is a very radical and destructive policy choice. I am just supporting a policy that we had last week. :P

  8. #148
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    What is even more compelling than that (to me) is the notion that law makers have every right to make laws affecting corporations, how they are taxed, how much, how they can use resources, hire, fire and what benefits they can provide (bonuses),.... But that a corporation should NOT have the same right that a 'person' would have to "speak" about it.

    It's lunacy.
    fyi i am against taxing bonuses, but not for constitutional reasons.

  9. #149
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Corporations are created to share the risk of owning a business amongst many people. It is not a person in itself. It is composed of people. The corporation does not have an income tax, the people who compose it are subject to the income tax. The free speech of a corporation should not be infringed upon because doing so infringes upon the free speech of the people who compose the corporation.
    This is a clever argument, but it fails because the nature of the corporation is different from the nature of the people who compose it. Because corporations have only one interest, profit, their behavior is significantly different from the individual behavior of its shareholders, who have many interests.

    When a corporation speaks for its interests, it speaks only for that one shared interest of all its shareholders. That one interest--drawing as much profit as possible from a business activity--should not overshadow the diverse interests of shareholders. Shareholders might, if you polled them, support any number of government actions (or inactions) because other interests overshadow profit. People who run corporations regularly do things in the pursuit of profit that they would not do in their personal lives.

  10. #150
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    Re: Corporate Personhood

    Quote Originally Posted by Rassales View Post
    This is a clever argument, but it fails because the nature of the corporation is different from the nature of the people who compose it. Because corporations have only one interest, profit, their behavior is significantly different from the individual behavior of its shareholders, who have many interests.
    Human action is always toward profit. In this way there is no difference between the corporation and a person.

    When a corporation speaks for its interests, it speaks only for that one shared interest of all its shareholders. That one interest--drawing as much profit as possible from a business activity--should not overshadow the diverse interests of shareholders. Shareholders might, if you polled them, support any number of government actions (or inactions) because other interests overshadow profit. People who run corporations regularly do things in the pursuit of profit that they would not do in their personal lives.
    Except that no one is stopping the separate entities that comprise the corporation from speaking out on those things that are most important to them.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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