View Poll Results: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

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  • Yes, a single celled zygote is in fact an organism

    99 51.30%
  • No, a single celled zygote is not in fact an organism

    94 48.70%
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Thread: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    At no point do humans have only one cell.

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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Uhhh No.

    It doesn't work like that,...

    I am not about to help you dodge my questions by answering yours.
    I've been answering your questions, why don't you answer mine.

    What questions do you still have that I haven't answered. Humans are multi cellular organisms. yes, there are unicellular organisms, but their reproduction and growth is only comparable to that of a zygote to a certain, very limited point.

    Human children, living things, are created by two parts that are very much NOT alive (sperm and egg combine to grow into child). The first cell on earth must have been created by non living parts. I know it's difficult to wrap your head around something that is so microscopic and out of the ordinary realm of perception.

    Anti-abortionists always want biologists to say that life begins at conception, but the fact is that not only is it difficult (if not impossible) to tell when a group of cells can be called an organism from a biological standpoint, but its just plain irrelevant.
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    joke Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by phildozer9121 View Post
    Human children, living things, are created by two parts that are very much NOT alive (sperm and egg combine to grow into child). .


    You and Ian being college students and all,... You guys surely have a cite or some other reference to support this claim.

    Would you mind posting it?

    I'm anxious to see how non living sperm and egg cells can unite and form annew child,...

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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post


    You and Ian being college students and all,... You guys surely have a cite or some other reference to support this claim.

    Would you mind posting it?

    I'm anxious to see how non living sperm and egg cells can unite and form annew child,...
    Have you heard of how nonorganic amino acids formed the first living things when the Earth was relatively new? Same principle, different details.
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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by phildozer9121 View Post
    Human children, living things, are created by two parts that are very much NOT alive (sperm and egg combine to grow into child).
    Of course those parts are alive.

    Why would you think they are not?

    Additionally, prove they are not, please.
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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Have you had your eyes checked?
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    Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?Stop the personal attacks.
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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Human children, living things, are created by two parts that are very much NOT alive (sperm and egg combine to grow into child).
    I would say that they aren't alive in the same sense that a person is alive - they are alive on the cellular level, but not at the organism level, because they aren't organisms.

    'Life' is a weird and not-well-defined term; especially when talking about the life of an organism. A human corpse on full life support will be composed almost entirely of living cells, but will be legally dead.
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    Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post


    You and Ian being college students and all,... You guys surely have a cite or some other reference to support this claim.

    Would you mind posting it?

    I'm anxious to see how non living sperm and egg cells can unite and form annew child,...
    They are cells created by your body through meiosis. I cite any modern biology text book you may care to reference. Just because something is a cell doesn't mean its an organism. When something is biologically alive, it must metabolize and reproduce. gametes (sperm and egg) cannot divide by themselves and therefore are not an organism. They combine to form a zygote.

    two cells are coming together to create a new cell with dna from both parents. that cell divides through mitosis, as do the rest of the cells in your body, and through the miracle of biology out comes you. When do those cells cease to be cells and become the multicellular organism that is a human? whenever that fetus is able to digest and metabolize its own food. and is able to grow.

    It's biology dawg
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    Arrow Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Have you heard of how nonorganic amino acids formed the first living things when the Earth was relatively new? Same principle, different details.
    Again, repeter (you voted yes in the poll, remember?),... I would like to see some reference materials where scientists have determined that semen and egg cells are "non-organic amino acids" and are not in fact,... alive.

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    idea Re: Is a single celled human zygote an 'organism'?

    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    I would say that they (zygotes) aren't alive in the same sense that a person is alive - they are alive on the cellular level, but not at the organism level, because they aren't organisms.
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    As your poll on this forum (and others) shows, that is by no means a consensus opinion.
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    This is simply not true. 'Biological fact' is simply what the scientific consensus states at the time - and there is no scientific consensus on the matter.
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    You haven't posted much evidence that directly supports your claims (certainly none on the 'scientific consensus'),
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    So far, you haven't produced any evidence on the 'scientific consensus' and all you have provided on 'a zygote is an organism' is three links, in another thread on a different forum,...
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    I'm looking forwards to the time when UEA releases all it's raw data. However, the massive worldwide scientific consensus on the truth of global warming is not based singly on the figures produced by a single department of a single university in a single country. There is a wealth of other data (the majority of IPCC, for example!) that also indicates global warming exists and is man-made and is not from UEA.
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    I was arguing that a ZEF is only an 'organism' (by dictionaries and scientific consensus) after birth,...
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    There is no scientific consensus on whether a zygote is an organism or not...
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    As I've said elsewhere - you have some people who consider a zygote an organism, I have some people who cosider it not to be. What you don't have is evidence that a scientific consensus exists, nor that such a consensus favours your claim over mine, nor even that this is a scientific question at all,..
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    I (have said that I) accept that some (in fact, probably several) scientists consider a zygote to be an organism. That still ain't a consensus, though.

    You haven't posted anything from a medical dictionary that unequivocally supports your position...
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    I'm saying that a single celled zygote is not even an organism - by scientific consensus, at least -
    Quote Originally Posted by iangb View Post
    ,... However, as arguments from authority go there is legitimacy to be had from a scientific consensus, so we shall push ahead with the term itself.

    <snip>

    ,... many of Chuz's sources disagree with the dictionary use shown above. However, the vast majority of them only show scientific opinions, not the consensus which is needed to get a definition into a widely used dictionary as I have been using.
    CONSENSUS

    1.majority of opinion: The consensus of the group was that they should meet twice a month.
    2.general agreement or concord; harmony.

    The Poll results on this subject (as of right now) are three to one against your position, Ian. What percentage does it take to have a consensus? A majority? A Genereal agreement?

    I know, I know,... you specified a "scientific consensus."

    What's say we have a contest? I'll post as many links to as many scientific sources that define a zygote as an organism,... and you provide as many as you can find where scientists say they are not.

    (I've posted several, already)

    At the end,... we will see which of us can support the notion of a "scientific consensus."

    Deal?
    Last edited by Chuz Life; 01-28-10 at 11:06 PM.

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