View Poll Results: Should schools have firewalls

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  • Yes

    50 76.92%
  • No

    12 18.46%
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Thread: Should School computers have firewalls?

  1. #61
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Iwa View Post
    my policy is: Rules are made to be broken or there wouldnt have to be rules.
    And it's a childish "policy" which shows exactly why you need supervision.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    If it's not obvious, there's not much point in saying it. I do hope you're not serious.
    i am serious

    you have not articulated a reason
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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  3. #63
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    And it's a childish "policy" which shows exactly why you need supervision.
    I grew up alone i supervise myself thanks very much. I don't need a babysitter to tell me that there are morons on the internet ^^
    It's not rape if you scream "SURPRISE" first.

  4. #64
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    The curriculum changes, and should do so appropriately as to adapt to the changing circumstances we live in.
    I'll believe that when they start teaching numerical analysis and Fortran in high school as standard education.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    As a student, you wont be able to survive in college without any type of exposure to a word processor or to internet browsing. Hell, just to be able to conduct an advanced search on a database would get you pretty far.
    You can have a typing class, as for browsing the internet, if you need lessons in that do humanity a favor and kill yourself. Seriously, who isn't going to "know" how to do that? Only the kids who can't afford the computer and internet; and apparently we don't give a rat's ass about them anyway. **** those kids, teach to the one's who can afford the technology.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    IMO, the problem isn't that computers are making kids dumber or lazier. The kids just haven't been properly exposed to the academic uses of the computer, they haven't been trained correctly (teacher's fault I suppose). They go home and they play games or socialize on the computer, they don't really go on there for studying. A lot of my students tell me that once they get home, the first thing they do is check facebook or myspace. It's their routine.
    I think people start relying on the technology as a crutch. A computer can be a very potentially powerful tool which allows you to do things which cannot be done any other way. The computational power allows for a lot of numerical analysis and theory which just cannot be done by hand. But in the academic setting below University (hell probably in University as well), it has become basically the electronic version of Cliff Notes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    The solution is not to force the student to learn without the computer, but instead make them aware and understand that the computer can be used efficiently in the academic sphere. There's been a lot of teachers who are beginning to integrate technology with their pedagogy, as have I.
    I mean, it really depends on what it's being used for. I can see applications for math, but those applications where it becomes necessary (like inverse problems) are very advanced and typically well above the standard high school student. You can teach programing like C++, Fortran, Visual Basic, etc. and that would be a good use of the technology too. But things like photoshop or whatever that's all pointless crap people can do for fun on their own time. The only place I could even see that as applicable would be maybe some art class.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    One of my ideas, which I am most proud of , is having my students create a short video for their projects. They should use video editing software, which I can show them where to download for free if they don't have any, usually the ones with Macs already have them. The students who post on YouTube definitely have them already. The video itself can come in the form of a short film, a news report, dramatization, or documentary style, or whatever they can come up with. It's quite amazing. One year I had a group of students who made a music video. It wouldn't surprise me (anymore) if one year I get a group of students who created an computer animated film.
    Things kinda like that have been around for a long time. I remember in high school doing video projects. It's not like it taught me to operate a video camera, but it was mostly stuff to do for fun in a class. I'm not sure if it's really teaching the true applications for the technology.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    The research that they do for this project usually turns out pretty good. My (non-scientific) explanation is that they were enjoying the work that they were doing and didn't mind the researching. Motivation I think is key. And computers can be used as a huge motivational boost. I think it's useless to fight against the use of computers, as it's going to be part of our lifestyles as the TV became part of our lifestyles in the 30s.
    But it typically comes down to citing wikipedia. Which does not behoove anyone. People need to learn that wikipedia isn't a valid source. Yes, the computer can help in looking up articles and books; but you'll have to read those too. Not copy and past out of some googled thing.

    I've seen the implementation of a lot of computer stuff on the University level. There is a lot of online homework for lower level physics classes; but that's usually done as a convenience for the professor. And even then, kids just tend to cheat. I think that's what's really be taught with a lot of the technology.
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Until the senior year, I don't think that kids have any need to be exposed to computers at all, except possibly for serious students in a technical course of study.

    I also don't approve of cooks. janitors or sports programs in schools.


    Call me old fashioned, although one would be better advized to call me Milord.
    In todays world Computers are a necessity. I think there should be Firewalls though. No cooks or Janitors??? thats a bit extreme although sports in school or college is unnecessary.

  6. #66
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    i am serious

    you have not articulated a reason
    Because adults have experience in the world that children do not.

    Do you propose letting the kids decide all school policy? If not, why not?
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  7. #67
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I'll believe that when they start teaching numerical analysis and Fortran in high school as standard education.
    What change in circumstances necessitate the teaching of this?? Does it have the same impact on social and cultural change as did the personal computer?

    You can have a typing class, as for browsing the internet, if you need lessons in that do humanity a favor and kill yourself. Seriously, who isn't going to "know" how to do that? Only the kids who can't afford the computer and internet; and apparently we don't give a rat's ass about them anyway. **** those kids, teach to the one's who can afford the technology.
    I speak from experience. Many students who use Google and Yahoo to search and browse have only a rudimentary understanding of how a search engine works. Narrowing down their search, a skill in researching, is absolutely important. And because it is a skill, training is needed (or at least that's what I believe).

    I think people start relying on the technology as a crutch. A computer can be a very potentially powerful tool which allows you to do things which cannot be done any other way. The computational power allows for a lot of numerical analysis and theory which just cannot be done by hand. But in the academic setting below University (hell probably in University as well), it has become basically the electronic version of Cliff Notes.
    That it has, there's no denying that. But that's what technology does...it makes things more efficient. It's always going to be a tool to quickly access information.

    I mean, it really depends on what it's being used for. I can see applications for math, but those applications where it becomes necessary (like inverse problems) are very advanced and typically well above the standard high school student. You can teach programing like C++, Fortran, Visual Basic, etc. and that would be a good use of the technology too. But things like photoshop or whatever that's all pointless crap people can do for fun on their own time. The only place I could even see that as applicable would be maybe some art class.
    I've allowed my students to use photoshop to (re)create some propaganda pieces in my history classes. They use powerpoint to showcase them. The benefits? Students don't need craft supplies. A little bit cheaper on the budget, since I provide the projector and powerpoint. They can use their own or the school's lab photoshop program.

    Things kinda like that have been around for a long time. I remember in high school doing video projects. It's not like it taught me to operate a video camera, but it was mostly stuff to do for fun in a class. I'm not sure if it's really teaching the true applications for the technology.
    Well, I grade on a rubric. They get scored on: creativity, accuracy, presentation, and energy/effort.

    And I'm not teaching they how to make a short film, that wasn't the goal. That was just a means to an end, which was to show me that they learned the history lesson. They don't need to know how to operate a camera or how to do video editing. But you know what? Many students DO know how to do video editing (especially on YouTube) and many students record stuff with their phones and cameras. I'm not teaching them how to use that stuff, I'm directing their "expertise" towards my lessons. I'm using the skills they already have to get new skills.

    But it typically comes down to citing wikipedia. Which does not behoove anyone. People need to learn that wikipedia isn't a valid source. Yes, the computer can help in looking up articles and books; but you'll have to read those too. Not copy and past out of some googled thing.

    I've seen the implementation of a lot of computer stuff on the University level. There is a lot of online homework for lower level physics classes; but that's usually done as a convenience for the professor. And even then, kids just tend to cheat. I think that's what's really be taught with a lot of the technology.
    In my line of work, after a few years, you develop an eye for plagiarism. If you get to know your students, know their habits, know their limits, you'll know the difference between authentic improvement and plagiarism. Though of course I don't expect to catch everyone all the time.

    The problem with this is that teachers need to do this with their 160+ kids. But what are you going to do, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    As an aside...the poll says there are 5 votes for "No" but I only see 3 names. Ikari can you run the numbers on Fortran and see if you can get an explanation?
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

  9. #69
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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    As an aside...the poll says there are 5 votes for "No" but I only see 3 names. Ikari can you run the numbers on Fortran and see if you can get an explanation?
    It doesn't take a Fortran program to say that people can vote when not logged in. In fact, even a simple experiment of logging out, clicking on this thread, and seeing if you can vote again would be simple enough to ferret out your answer. Did you really need me to spell it out for you?
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Should School computers have firewalls?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    It doesn't take a Fortran program to say that people can vote when not logged in. In fact, even a simple experiment of logging out, clicking on this thread, and seeing if you can vote again would be simple enough to ferret out your answer. Did you really need me to spell it out for you?
    Lighten up man, it was a joke....
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

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