View Poll Results: Do you have a conceal and carry permit?

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  • Yes I do

    21 29.17%
  • No I do not

    38 52.78%
  • I don't have one yet, but I'm working on it

    9 12.50%
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    4 5.56%
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Thread: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

  1. #371
    Educator Alvin T. Grey's Avatar
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    First off, sorry for the late reply. I spend the weekend north of the border with herself and the kids. That's family time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    You have the rest of your life to win a gunfight.... I don't consider extra ballistics "extra"....
    Our disagreement is in the scenario. For a home invasion I disagree that it is a good idea to shoot through solid barriers as your family may be in the line of fire.
    That would be my ultimate nightmare.



    Like I said, I can conceal a full framed .45 if I need to.... There are other options...
    All dependant on your size, your lifestyle etc. You get the one that fits most of your situations because you can keep it with you most of the time.


    Reducing caliber for convienence is not a compromise I am willing to make.
    Often times that decision may be made for you. As I said it depends on who you are and what you do.






    if she doesn't want to "spring for an expensive rig" then she has no business wanting to CC....
    Wanting the best and being able to spring for it are two different things. For example I want a Ferrari. That doesn't mean I should drive a car though. Until I can afford a Ferrari or until I'm in a position to get the best out of a Ferrari, I'll drive my VW. It does the job it's supposed to. Sure it wond do 0-60 in 3sec. But how often is that needed?


    This is not a compromise thing... If you need to carry a smaller weapon in your cocktail dress then by all means select the appropriate tool, however, its a severe compromise in effectiveness.
    The point being that the lady is only beginning. I feel that it is a much better idea that she is comfortable and competant using a single type of firearm before throwing in a second. I may be underestemating her, but I guess she's at the beginning of a learning curve.



    Really, they teach you how to fight and defend yourself with a handgun?



    tell me about some of the drills you do.
    Ok, here we go.
    First off, I was incorrect in saying that.
    They do not teach that.
    It is illegal in this country to provide that level of training.

    The nearest a civillian or non law enforcement can get is Practical Pistol.
    That particular discpline is only legal here in the last couple of years.
    I want to say 2005, but I'm not sure. My training predates that by about 15 years.

    So we may be talking about chalk and cheese. Add to that that what we call 'advanced' is not what you call it.
    I'll have to remember that in future.

    Apologies.

  2. #372
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    blowing out his rectum.
    Wrecked 'im?

    Damn near kilt 'im!


    [/pun]
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  3. #373
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alvin T. Grey View Post
    First off, sorry for the late reply. I spend the weekend north of the border with herself and the kids. That's family time.



    Our disagreement is in the scenario. For a home invasion I disagree that it is a good idea to shoot through solid barriers as your family may be in the line of fire.
    That would be my ultimate nightmare.


    Target identification. Target identification. Target Identification.


    Did I mention target identification?


    I am not advocating shooting unkowingly through a wall, however if the savage is shooting around a hall entrance, Why not aim for the sheetrock?




    Also have a plan, that involves the whole family...





    All dependant on your size, your lifestyle etc. You get the one that fits most of your situations because you can keep it with you most of the time.
    Or you buy a 2nd platform for that scenario.



    Often times that decision may be made for you. As I said it depends on who you are and what you do.
    like?




    Wanting the best and being able to spring for it are two different things. For example I want a Ferrari. That doesn't mean I should drive a car though. Until I can afford a Ferrari or until I'm in a position to get the best out of a Ferrari, I'll drive my VW. It does the job it's supposed to. Sure it wond do 0-60 in 3sec. But how often is that needed?

    a ferrarri is half a million. a pistol, of good choice is under 1k. not the same.

    and speeding is not the same as fighting for your life.


    The point being that the lady is only beginning. I feel that it is a much better idea that she is comfortable and competant using a single type of firearm before throwing in a second. I may be underestemating her, but I guess she's at the beginning of a learning curve.

    quite possible, fundamentals with a .22 then jump up to a competent caliber.





    Ok, here we go.
    First off, I was incorrect in saying that.
    They do not teach that.
    It is illegal in this country to provide that level of training.

    The nearest a civillian or non law enforcement can get is Practical Pistol.
    That particular discpline is only legal here in the last couple of years.
    I want to say 2005, but I'm not sure. My training predates that by about 15 years.

    So we may be talking about chalk and cheese. Add to that that what we call 'advanced' is not what you call it.
    I'll have to remember that in future.

    Apologies.


    No worries. When I say defense course, keep in mind I have been involved in teaching and training both carbine and pistol for 15+ years. owning a gun and hitting paper with it is not adequate training in the use of a weapon for self defense, and I argue it could make you more dangerous....


    Training. training, and more training. Train like your life depended on it.




    I find it shocking that in your country, self defense is illegal.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  4. #374
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Sane View Post
    Again, I'm not an anti-gun nut, I have a concealed pistol license. Personally, I would never conceal, unless I felt it was NECESSARY, for me that means a direct threat against my life. Just the "possibility" that something "might" happen, doesn't do it for me, that one should carry a dangerous weapon around. Honestly, and without a doubt my MAIN point, that when it comes to SELF-DEFENSE, Guns are a LAST resort. Heck, reading through this thread, it seems (and I refer in part to the topic starter), that people havn't considered other options. Nor, do they consider the LEGAL RAMIFICATIONS, of drawing or using their gun. You, best of all in this thread should know Use of Force Doctrine. Sheesh, as I said, thats my personal feelings on when people should carry.

    For you, its one of many in your arsenal for self-defense. But, I'm not going to blindly say, everyone should carry, nor even recommend it. Seriously, of permit holders, how many carry on a regular basis, find that stat for me. For some its the novelty of it. Most people can't carry it in to work, and do you really want to leave it locked in your car? Damn, there is 5 days a week, your walking un-armed.

    Seriously, there are other and better options out there. Guns, at least to me speak to the single-minded approach a lot of us take to self-defense. That doesn't apply to you, but to suggest it doesn't apply to anyone with a permit...get off it. Seriously, what is it with guns and American culture that we get so damn Touchy-Feely, when someone just disagrees.

    And that is why I feel I havn't shown disrespect. I don't agree with a lot of things in our society, but heck, we have the Freedom to do as we please for the most part. And I'm happy we do.


    And for **** sake, it is hard to take this thread seriously. Its a poll on who has a permit or not, and there is very little discussion or debate, and quite a few cowboys.



    dood you keep throwing out insults, is there a reason for this? I mean, you claim you don't show disrespect then you do just that....

    Taking from your statements such as taking aikido is a good way to defend oneself in a gunfight or ever, I can only surmise that you are ignorant to what it takes to survive in a life or death altercation.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  5. #375
    Educator Alvin T. Grey's Avatar
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    Target identification. Target identification. Target Identification.


    Did I mention target identification?
    Yep, and over penetration. Basically knowing what is beyond your target


    I am not advocating shooting unkowingly through a wall, however if the savage is shooting around a hall entrance, Why not aim for the sheetrock?
    If you can gaurentee hitting your target, yep. My nightmare would be missing and the round going through a plasterboard wall and into the next room.




    Also have a plan, that involves the whole family...
    Sounds good.



    like?
    A middle school teacher? cocktail waitress? Anywhere where it could be difficult to conceal, or if carrying may be frowned upon.







    a ferrarri is half a million. a pistol, of good choice is under 1k. not the same.

    and speeding is not the same as fighting for your life.
    The point is stilll somewhat valid even if the analogy isn't I believe.


    I find it shocking that in your country, self defense is illegal.
    It's not and never was illegal exactly... Basically you needed to show that your life was in danger. Lead to all sorts of issues did that.
    For example if you shot someone who was armed with a less than leathal weapon you were in trouble.
    But what is a less than leathal weapon I hear you ask?
    That's a good question...

    If you shot someone outside your front door, or halfway through your window, you were in trouble.

    That is changing again at the moment to make the homeowner less culpable and to put the burden of proof more on the intruder.

  6. #376
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alvin T. Grey View Post
    Yep, and over penetration. Basically knowing what is beyond your target

    true. know what you are shooting.


    If you can gaurentee hitting your target, yep. My nightmare would be missing and the round going through a plasterboard wall and into the next room.

    If thats what you think works for you, i wouldn't suggest anything else. To me however, knowing you have the firepower to end the threat and the training to use this force appropriatly is the solution.

    Though I would say, if you live in an apartment townhouse adjoining community type housing. overpenetration is a risk




    A middle school teacher? cocktail waitress? Anywhere where it could be difficult to conceal, or if carrying may be frowned upon.
    Cocktail waitress maybe... a school teacher can wear something that could conceal even a large frame pistole.






    The point is stilll somewhat valid even if the analogy isn't I believe.

    not really. a month without going to the pub and you'd have enough.


    It's not and never was illegal exactly... Basically you needed to show that your life was in danger. Lead to all sorts of issues did that.
    For example if you shot someone who was armed with a less than leathal weapon you were in trouble.
    But what is a less than leathal weapon I hear you ask?
    That's a good question...

    If you shot someone outside your front door, or halfway through your window, you were in trouble.

    That is changing again at the moment to make the homeowner less culpable and to put the burden of proof more on the intruder.

    scary....
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  7. #377
    Educator Alvin T. Grey's Avatar
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    true. know what you are shooting.





    If thats what you think works for you, i wouldn't suggest anything else. To me however, knowing you have the firepower to end the threat and the training to use this force appropriatly is the solution.

    Though I would say, if you live in an apartment townhouse adjoining community type housing. overpenetration is a risk
    I agree. And seeing as I don't know what the lady in questions circumstances actually are I suggested that she speaks to a good instructor in person. I don't know any substute for personal advise in that respect.



    Cocktail waitress maybe... a school teacher can wear something that could conceal even a large frame pistole.
    Again the ladys specifics are a mystery here. That's why I suggested something you can conceal anywhere, and have it on you most of the time regardless. I simply believe that if one feels threatened enough to think about concealed carry, one must have the tools available at any given time. And as G. said, it's better than throwing rocks.






    not really. a month without going to the pub and you'd have enough.
    I don't drink that much.

    Ok.
    Maybe 6 weeks would do it.





    scary....
    Depends how you look at it.
    I'm fully convinced that the reason you need firearms in the US is because you have them, and because you have them, you need them.
    A criminal doesn't break into a house armed over here because he doesn't expect to encounter an armed response. And because the owner doesn't expect an armed criminal, he doesn't feel the need to be armed.

    The result is a very low instance of gun violence among the general population.

    What is truely scary are those in the US that think that banning guns based on a reduction in crime is a good idea. That horse bolted about the time the constitution was signed. The Guns are out there, there is no taking them back.
    Equally as scary are those on the opposite side that think that just because you are American means you should have unlimited access to firearms at will.

    I fall somewhere in the middle.
    I think (an it's only an opinion) that the key to having a safe and armed society is the responsible ownership of guns. And I feel that the NRA etc has gone about it all arse about face.

  8. #378
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    While I oppose legal restrictions on munitions, I do agree with selecting a round with less penetration for home invasion.

    You can know what you're shooting at and be aware of your background, and miss. You can miss-fire. The gun can fire in unintended directions during a struggle. You could not notice a family member's movement and think the room behind your target is empty when you fire. More powerful rounds can go through your target.

    I realize that it's easy to deny all of this in an online setting and claim that your plan is perfect, that you will never make a mistake, that you are better than any criminal who could ever assault you and that you will always have complete control over every situation; but that's not actually real.

  9. #379
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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    While I oppose legal restrictions on munitions, I do agree with selecting a round with less penetration for home invasion.

    You can know what you're shooting at and be aware of your background, and miss. You can miss-fire. The gun can fire in unintended directions during a struggle. You could not notice a family member's movement and think the room behind your target is empty when you fire. More powerful rounds can go through your target.

    I realize that it's easy to deny all of this in an online setting and claim that your plan is perfect, that you will never make a mistake, that you are better than any criminal who could ever assault you and that you will always have complete control over every situation; but that's not actually real.
    all plans are perfect until the first 7.62 whizzes by.



    There are pros and cons to both. Me im concerned with a rou d that wont penetrate sheetrock penetrating a thick leather jacket for example
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Do you have a conceal and carry license?

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    all plans are perfect until the first 7.62 whizzes by.



    There are pros and cons to both. Me im concerned with a rou d that wont penetrate sheetrock penetrating a thick leather jacket for example
    You should have no problem with a 9mm hollow point or similar, considering the close range you would be at.

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