View Poll Results: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income one makes?

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  • Yes

    40 35.40%
  • no

    64 56.64%
  • maybe/other

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Thread: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

  1. #101
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    As the OP is talking about fines, not prison sentences, this is not a good example.

    This is something I agree with.

    Here in California a carpool or trafic light camera fine comes out to about a weeks pay for a minimum wage person. If a weeks pay is the standard of punishment for some, it should be about a weeks pay for all.
    But they're not saying "we're charging a week's pay", they're saying "we're charging X". If that fine is levied against a person below the poverty line, where it's a year's pay, are you going to argue that everyone should pay a year's pay?

    It's absurd.
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Those of us who have cops in our familiers or who have close relationships with them,.. know very well about "non quota,... quotas."

    Consider drug confiscation laws and many departments get to "keep" all the money and toys they find (and confiscate.)

    Should it be that way? No.

    But you can't deny the reality that the temptation is there.
    Remember though, quotas are a function of revenue devolving from tickets, and if some tickets yielded much more revenue there might be less need for them.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
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  3. #103
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    But they're not saying "we're charging a week's pay", they're saying "we're charging X". If that fine is levied against a person below the poverty line, where it's a year's pay, are you going to argue that everyone should pay a year's pay?

    It's absurd.
    I never said to reduce the idea to absurdity.

    To say the punishment for crimes should be equal, that if the punishment is ten years then everybody gets ten years, makes sense as long as some are not "immortal" making ten years effectively nothing.

    The entire concept of "fines" is economic violence. Punishment by financial means as opposed to corporal. Therefore, equal fines are NOT equal punishment. Its the equivalent of saying some should get ten years and some should get one. You pay a weeks pay, this other guy pays ten seconds pay. Not the same punishment.
    Anyone wondering what I'm talking about start here:
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  4. #104
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    I vote no. We already have a point system that theoretically applies to everyone equally. A law like this could encourage law enforcement to go after everyone who drives a decent car.

  5. #105
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    I vote no. We already have a point system that theoretically applies to everyone equally. A law like this could encourage law enforcement to go after everyone who drives a decent car.
    So why not just eliminate fines for traffic fines and just go with a point system?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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  6. #106
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    I never said to reduce the idea to absurdity.

    To say the punishment for crimes should be equal, that if the punishment is ten years then everybody gets ten years, makes sense as long as some are not "immortal" making ten years effectively nothing.

    The entire concept of "fines" is economic violence. Punishment by financial means as opposed to corporal. Therefore, equal fines are NOT equal punishment. Its the equivalent of saying some should get ten years and some should get one. You pay a weeks pay, this other guy pays ten seconds pay. Not the same punishment.
    Sure it is because the fines are not defined by pay, they are defined by the crime. Do crime X, get penalty Y. Everyone who does crime X gets penalty Y. That is equal. Unless you're willing to charge absolutely everyone who does crime X a certain percentage of their pay, from Bill Gates all the way down to the lowest bum on the street corner, then to do it at all is inequal.
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So why not just eliminate fines for traffic fines and just go with a point system?
    while i wouldn't necessarily be against that, there would still have to be some way to pay for traffic enforcement. tickets are a user fee, but one that needs a lot of oversight to minimize abuse.

  8. #108
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So why not just eliminate fines for traffic fines and just go with a point system?
    Politicians aren't eliminating any source of revenue, no matter how much sense it would make to do so.

  9. #109
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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    Remember though, quotas are a function of revenue devolving from tickets, and if some tickets yielded much more revenue there might be less need for them.
    the entire concept would be thrown out on "equal protection grounds" and would cause massive problems. small towns would target wealthy drivers for tickets while letting scofflaws driving crappy cars go. The 42 USC 1983 suits would go through the roof. those who sell expensive cars would probably get into the act as well



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    Re: Should traffic fines and other fines be based on the income the offender makes?

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    The problem with fines is that for those with enough money to ignore them, they fail to act as a deterrent. However, speeding tickets also lead to license suspension, so I would say that income based fines aren't required.
    I totally agree. If one keeps producing tickets, it's the license that has to go.

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