View Poll Results: Is marriage a right?

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  • Yes.

    25 43.10%
  • No.

    33 56.90%
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Thread: Is marriage a right?

  1. #131
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Wheres the "i dont know" option?

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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rassales View Post
    I agree, though I don't think supposed Christians should go unchallenged when they make claims based on scriptures they only know in translation and whose context they've made no attempt to understand.

    In other words, not only does the Bible have no standing in American law--it doesn't even say what some believers think it does.
    Absolutely. The Bible may be one of the most purchased books out there but it is also one of the least read and certainly least understood. That's because most people who cling to it do so on faith, they don't have any clue where anything in the Bible came from, they just blindly accept whatever the guy in the funny robes in the pulpit says.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  3. #133
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    I supose its for the government to decide.
    The third-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the majority. The second-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking with the minority. The first-rate mind is only happy when it is thinking.

  4. #134
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Reviewing the original question in this thread, it would seem that in order to answer the question posed, "Is marriage a right", one would have to define marriage first.

    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage]Marriage - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]


    marriage - Definition from the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary

    Main Entry: mar•riage
    Pronunciation: \'mer-ij, 'ma-rij\
    Function: noun
    Etymology: Middle English mariage, from Anglo-French, from marier to marry
    Date: 14th century
    1 a (1) : the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2) : the state of being united to a person of the same sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage <same-sex marriage> b : the mutual relation of married persons : wedlock c : the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage
    2 : an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is effected; especially : the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities
    3 : an intimate or close union <the marriage of painting and poetry — J. T. Shawcross>
    If one accepts the premise that the Merriam-Webster Dictionary is correct, then:

    Marriage can be either:
    1. A legal union between two persons, or.
    2. A union between two persons, not recognized by law as such.


    Note that Merriam-Webster does not mention any religious aspect of marriage, and includes same-sex marriage in its definition.

    It is incorrect to say that there is no religious aspect to marriage, IMO.
    Even if at one point in time there was no religious aspect to them, there is now.
    So, basically, I disagree with their definition, and additionally am of the opinion that it is partially influenced by political considerations.

    Anyone have an opinion on my rambling?
    Education.

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  5. #135
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    It is incorrect to say that there is no religious aspect to marriage, IMO.
    Individuals can include their religion in their marriage all they want, that's as far as a religious aspect goes. Religion has zero bearing on the legal aspects of marriage, which is all that matters as far as gay marriage, etc. goes. It's not really that there are religious aspects, but that religions take an interest in marriage and try desperately to force their views on society.

    Sorry, doesn't work that way.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  6. #136
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rassales View Post
    Back at ya.
    Except that I am not wrong. I have proven that marriage is a privilege, as it is someting that you can have only because the state allows it, and that it woudl cease to exist if the state were to repeal the laws that offer it.

    You have done nothing to counter this - indeed, rather than counter it, you have only put forth a red herring argument regarding 'equal protection' -- which, you agree, covers MOST, but not all, people.

  7. #137
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rassales View Post
    Not quite. I say that if exceptions are to be made, they need to be made for a reason. So far, you've provided no reason.
    I don't need to provde a reason, I only need to show that EP does not cover ALL people. I've done that, and so my use of the word "most" stands as sound.

  8. #138
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    I don't need to provde a reason, I only need to show that EP does not cover ALL people. I've done that, and so my use of the word "most" stands as sound.
    You've hardly done that. All equivalent people have the same rights. Arguing that because a 5-year old child can't vote, that equal protection doesn't count is ludicrous. The fact remains that *ALL* people, at age 18, get the right to vote. It doesn't matter if they're black or white, male or female, gay or straight, all gain the same rights at the same time. That's equal protection.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  9. #139
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    You've hardly done that. All equivalent people have the same rights. Arguing that because a 5-year old child can't vote, that equal protection doesn't count is ludicrous.
    On the contrary -- your example, above, absolutely proves my assertion that EP necessitates that when the state offers ia privilege, it must offer it to MOST people, not ALL people.

    The fact remains that *ALL* people, at age 18, get the right to vote.
    MOST people. Non-citizens, who are still people, cannot vote.

  10. #140
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    Re: Is marriage a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    On the contrary -- your example, above, absolutely proves my assertion that EP necessitates that when the state offers ia privilege, it must offer it to MOST people, not ALL people.
    To all equivalent people. You keep conveniently ignoring the "equivalent" part, mostly because it destroys your argument.

    MOST people. Non-citizens, who are still people, cannot vote.
    Of course not, they're not part of the society and rights are granted by society. Is this the best you can do?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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