View Poll Results: Which do you prefer:

Voters
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  • Income tax - no changes in the status quo

    39 19.80%
  • Flat tax - Everyone pays the same %

    67 34.01%
  • National sales tax - don't spend, you don't pay taxes

    47 23.86%
  • No tax - Unconstitutional - rely on private donations

    10 5.08%
  • Other - explain

    21 10.66%
  • Cookies!

    13 6.60%
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Thread: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

  1. #831
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Turtle
    in thread after thread, in post after post after post, for month after month after month, and no matter what the topic and how it varies - you demonstrate a complete lack of comprehension in the differences between a) the relationship between a government and its citizen in a representative democracy, and b) a commercial transaction in which you purchase a good for a price.

    Why is this?
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  2. #832
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    yeah the constitutional republic as originally created didn't allow such taxes

    morons changed that without having a clue of the damage it would and dd cause

    welfare-socialism is the new opiate of the masses and those so addicted are no longer as able to compete
    I can't disagree that welfare policies create adverse incentives, but not so much that it will prevent someone from trying to improve his or her life. The welfare life is not particularly glamorous. And your stance discounts social mobility. Very few people collect welfare their whole lives. Most people move in and out of tax brackets. My stance is that social safety nets and the progressive income tax help preserve that social mobility by diverting wealth into poorer communities.

  3. #833
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Turtle
    in thread after thread, in post after post after post, for month after month after month, and no matter what the topic and how it varies - you demonstrate a complete lack of comprehension in the differences between a) the relationship between a government and its citizen in a representative democracy, and b) a commercial transaction in which you purchase a good for a price.

    Why is this?

    for post after post, day after day you franticly claim that I don't understand because I argue what I think things should be and why that would be better than the current situation.



  4. #834
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    I can't disagree that welfare policies create adverse incentives, but not so much that it will prevent someone from trying to improve his or her life. The welfare life is not particularly glamorous. And your stance discounts social mobility. Very few people collect welfare their whole lives. Most people move in and out of tax brackets. My stance is that social safety nets and the progressive income tax help preserve that social mobility by diverting wealth into poorer communities.
    we had far more social mobility because we had a massive welfare state. the net is way too big and has created far more sloths than the truly needy who have been saved

    if people who spawn children they cannot pay for suffered severely for that, we'd have far less poverty



  5. #835
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    for post after post, day after day you franticly claim that I don't understand because I argue what I think things should be and why that would be better than the current situation.
    Then please stick to your utopian dreams and stop trying to use what you think real life is to justify them. You cannot have it both ways.
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  6. #836
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    that is based on the risk to the loaner-your example fails

    income isn't the issue-credit rating is

    and on a 300K mortgage a guy making a billion a year is treated no differently than someone with the same credit rating making 500K a year
    The point is that people are treated differently based on their financial status in many areas of society. You don't characterize differing interest rates on loans as unjust, but you do characterize progressive taxation as unjust. Why is it justifiable to discriminate based on income in one sector but not the other?

  7. #837
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    we had far more social mobility because we had a massive welfare state. the net is way too big and has created far more sloths than the truly needy who have been saved

    if people who spawn children they cannot pay for suffered severely for that, we'd have far less poverty
    But you've said before that the poor have pretty good conditions in this country. So you want the poor to suffer more so that they have to work harder to have decent lives? I don't think that's a good solution to societal ills.

  8. #838
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Then please stick to your utopian dreams and stop trying to use what you think real life is to justify them. You cannot have it both ways.

    more strawman nonsense



  9. #839
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    The point is that people are treated differently based on their financial status in many areas of society. You don't characterize differing interest rates on loans as unjust, but you do characterize progressive taxation as unjust. Why is it justifiable to discriminate based on income in one sector but not the other?
    the difference is that those with more means are treated better by a seller as they should be while the government does not. People are rich mainly because they act in productive ways that benefit others not because the government GAVE THEM SOMETHING EXTRA



  10. #840
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostlyJoe View Post
    But you've said before that the poor have pretty good conditions in this country. So you want the poor to suffer more so that they have to work harder to have decent lives? I don't think that's a good solution to societal ills.
    iF WE MADE POVERTY more painful less people would remain mired in it



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