View Poll Results: Which do you prefer:

Voters
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  • Income tax - no changes in the status quo

    39 19.80%
  • Flat tax - Everyone pays the same %

    67 34.01%
  • National sales tax - don't spend, you don't pay taxes

    47 23.86%
  • No tax - Unconstitutional - rely on private donations

    10 5.08%
  • Other - explain

    21 10.66%
  • Cookies!

    13 6.60%
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Thread: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

  1. #681
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Harry View Post
    To pay for the things that allowed the person to get weathly. They could not have done it alone or without a stable environment created by the government or educated employees educated by the government or the infrastructure created by the government. They benefited most from government spending.
    those people pay tons of income tax, death taxes and pay the burden for many who pay nothing

    claiming they benefit most is complete bs-the biggest expansion in government spending over the last 70 years is entitlements for the lower and middle classes

    try again



  2. #682
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TheGirlNextDoor View Post
    Which would you prefer: (over simplistic - just a poll)

    Income tax - nothing changes and the tax system as we know it continues on as always - changing and morphing month to month

    Flat tax - Revisions to current tax code in effect doing away with all other forms of taxation except for a low percentage of flat tax across the board

    National Sales tax - Revisions to current tax code in effect doing away with all other forms of taxation except for a nation wide sales tax - if you spend nothing, you pay nothing

    No tax - The tax codes as written currently are un-Constitutional and therefore should be abolished entirely. In place of taxes, we would rely on donations by private citizens/corporations.
    I think the reason why there's such a conflict as to "what to do" is because there are different issues at hand.

    Recession: what to do to *get out of it*
    Excessive government spending: this needs assessment, various solutions, and people to actually concede that they *need to do something*
    Balanced budget: you have to be able to GET there to begin with and STAY there.
    How to not lose sight of your balanced budget, etc: once you're out of the muck and on a stable path you have to learn how NOT to stray - this would require action BEFORE bad things happen.

    So some of people's suggestions work great WHILE you're in a recession - to get out. But after you're out they would need to be discontinued.
    Other things won'tw ork at all to get a country OUT of a recession - but when you're out you can transition to them.

    There's just no *one* right policy to enact - such a thing needs continual reassessment without losing focus.
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  3. #683
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    those people pay tons of income tax, death taxes and pay the burden for many who pay nothing

    claiming they benefit most is complete bs-the biggest expansion in government spending over the last 70 years is entitlements for the lower and middle classes

    try again
    Do you think the rich could have become rich without the rest of the country?
    Did you know many rich people don't pay any tax.
    Last edited by Dirty Harry; 01-20-11 at 03:43 PM.

  4. #684
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Harry View Post
    Do you think the rich could have become rich without the rest of the country?
    that is not an argument to make the top 1% pay 40% of the income tax and all the death and proposed wealth tax

    this country was #1 in the world and had plenty of rich before we started the New Deal



  5. #685
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    this country was #1 in the world and had plenty of rich before we started the New Deal
    There are a lot more rich people now. Everyone is better off now than before the New Deal.

  6. #686
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Harry View Post
    There are a lot more rich people now. Everyone is better off now than before the New Deal.
    and there is no proof that the New Deal caused that. what we do know is that FDR's lapdog jurists allowed massive expansions of federal power that serve as the foundation for our out of control government we have today

    rich people tend to do well under most systems. its the poor who benefit the most from this sort of society



  7. #687
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Harry View Post
    There are a lot more rich people now. Everyone is better off now than before the New Deal.
    Only very few things are remaining from the actual New Deal (one and two). Several of it's key active compnents at THAT time were ruled unconstitutional and some of what's left is a burden and has created many other unstable areas of government and the economy (Social Security - for example).

    Yet other thinsg that came directly from it (public works projects as one example) - are actually a key failing point of our infrastructure (bridges, damns, etc - many have run their course and need repair and to be rebuilt). What the "New Deal" really marked was an increase in government regulation, notice, action and activity in the business-worlds. Up until then things were predominately separated - laissez faire, really.

    But, many economic analysts argue that the New Deal didn't boost us out of the Depression - in stead- they argue that we started to grow out of it *naturally* - and then the war hit. To make this point they usually sight the fact that the government was compelled to enact two, not just one, "new deal" efforts.

    However, what's more important to note when you look at the history of wealth, where it accumulates, average income, etc - is that what played a key part in change people's lives and living standards in general wasn't *the New Deal* - it was the *Industrial Revolution* - predating the Great Depression by a while.
    And uncontrolled explosion of business and factory growth netted the need for heavier regulation (safety concerns, etc).

    But my post is stil just a shortened mentioning of these things - it's a very complex situation.
    Last edited by Aunt Spiker; 01-20-11 at 04:14 PM.
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  8. #688
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Only very few things are remaining from the actual New Deal (one and two). Several of it's key active compnents at THAT time were ruled unconstitutional and some of what's left is a burden and has created many other unstable areas of government and the economy (Social Security - for example).

    Yet other thinsg that came directly from it (public works projects as one example) - are actually a key failing point of our infrastructure (bridges, damns, etc - many have run their course and need repair and to be rebuilt). What the "New Deal" really marked was an increase in government regulation, notice, action and activity in the business-worlds. Up until then things were predominately separated - laissez faire, really.

    But, many economic analysts argue that the New Deal didn't boost us out of the Depression - in stead- they argue that we started to grow out of it *naturally* - and then the war hit. To make this point they usually sight the fact that the government was compelled to enact two, not just one, "new deal" efforts.

    However, what's more important to note when you look at the history of wealth, where it accumulates, average income, etc - is that what played a key part in change people's lives and living standards in general wasn't *the New Deal* - it was the *Industrial Revolution* - predating the Great Depression by a while.
    And uncontrolled explosion of business and factory growth netted the need for heavier regulation (safety concerns, etc).

    But my post is stil just a shortened mentioning of these things - it's a very complex situation.
    What led to this country's growth after WWII hit was unprecidented massive government spending. Some people seem to ignore that fact and say it was just the war that saved the economy. It was the spending.

  9. #689
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Harry View Post
    What led to this country's growth after WWII hit was unprecidented massive government spending. Some people seem to ignore that fact and say it was just the war that saved the economy. It was the spending.
    In some ways we grew - in other ways we declined.

    One way in which we grew was by lending money out to other countries who needed to rebuild their infrastructure - over the decades since some have paid off their loans + interest.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  10. #690
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    Re: Income tax; Flat tax; National Sales tax; No tax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Harry View Post
    What led to this country's growth after WWII hit was unprecidented massive government spending. Some people seem to ignore that fact and say it was just the war that saved the economy. It was the spending.
    sometimes giving a patient morphine is good

    sometimes it will kill him



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