View Poll Results: The United States Constitution protects

Voters
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  • The Biological "person"

    9 40.91%
  • The Metaphysical "person"

    3 13.64%
  • Other ; Please explain

    10 45.45%
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Thread: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

  1. #121
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    OxymoronP's Avatar
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    Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Biological person obviously, and no the fetus inside the tummy is not a person.


    THE GREATEST FREEDOM IS THE FREEDOM TO OPPRESS OTHERS

  2. #122
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    Cool Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by OxymoronP View Post
    Biological person obviously, and no the fetus inside the tummy is not a person.
    Almost got me,...

    I've read too many of your other posts to take the bait.

    Just once I wish I could find a choicer who will give direct answers to the questions comments like this provoke.

    Maybe someday.

  3. #123
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    OxymoronP's Avatar
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    Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Almost got me,...

    I've read too many of your other posts to take the bait.

    Just once I wish I could find a choicer who will give direct answers to the questions comments like this provoke.

    Maybe someday.
    A choicer I love broad insulting tags. In any case what answer are you looking for?


    THE GREATEST FREEDOM IS THE FREEDOM TO OPPRESS OTHERS

  4. #124
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    Anarcho-fascist's Avatar
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    Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    You are the first person to vote "metaphysical," Anarcho...

    Can you elaborate for me?
    Well, I chose "metaphysical" as the best option, but I wouldn't normally use the word like I did in the previous post. I don't mean "metaphysical" as in "supernatural" (I'm an atheist). What I mean is this: The Constitution protects our rights as rational/thinking/feeling/conscious humans.

    Rocks don't have rights because they aren't conscious.

    Animals don't have the same level of rights as us because they aren't at the same "level" as us. PETA is full of wackos, and I eat meat, but I support fair animal cruelty/welfare laws.

    Of course protecting the sentient "person" entails protecting the physical "person", because afaik the sentient originates in the physical, but human rights wouldn't make sense if humans weren't aware. I would have few qualms about letting someone who has absolutely ZERO chance of waking up from a deep dreamless coma die.

    I wouldn't usually use "metaphysical" to describe rights but I think it's close enough if it's the only option.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thesaurus
    metaphysical
    adjective
    1 "metaphysical questions" abstract, theoretical, conceptual, notional, philosophical, speculative, intellectual, academic.
    2 "Good and Evil are inextricably linked in a metaphysical battle" transcendental, spiritual, supernatural, paranormal.
    More sense 1, less sense 2.

  5. #125
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    Question Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by OxymoronP View Post
    A choicer I love broad insulting tags. In any case what answer are you looking for?
    Not sure how being called a choicer is an insult,... but ok.

    Are you willing to do a question and answer session,... one question at a time?

    One question per post?

  6. #126
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    Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Not sure how being called a choicer is an insult,... but ok.
    Because it is a made up word, and it sounds negative. I mean would you want to be called any sort of er? I mean Breader, Breather, Eater, ****ter etc.

    Are you willing to do a question and answer session,... one question at a time?

    One question per post?[
    Sure why not.


    THE GREATEST FREEDOM IS THE FREEDOM TO OPPRESS OTHERS

  7. #127
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    Question Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarcho-fascist View Post
    (I'm an atheist).
    Oh, thank God!

    ( just kidding)


    Quote Originally Posted by Anarcho-fascist View Post
    What I mean is this: The Constitution protects our rights as rational/thinking/feeling/conscious humans.
    Please provide a reference or source which supports this claim.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarcho-fascist View Post
    Rocks don't have rights because they aren't conscious.
    And here I thought that rocks don't have rights just because they aren't alive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarcho-fascist View Post
    Animals don't have the same level of rights as us because they aren't at the same "level" as us.
    Again,.. if you have a reference for this... can you provide it? It's not that I disagree,... but I really would like to see something in the way of a reference that supports your claim here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarcho-fascist View Post
    Of course protecting the sentient "person" entails protecting the physical "person", because afaik the sentient originates in the physical, but human rights wouldn't make sense if humans weren't aware.
    I'm curious.

    How "aware" do you think my preemie daughter was, when she was born?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarcho-fascist View Post
    I would have few qualms about letting someone who has absolutely ZERO chance of waking up from a deep dreamless coma die.
    Two years ago, my wife suffered full cardiac arrest. She required 45 minutes of CPR. She was hit with the defib at least nine times. She lapsed into a coma immediately,... her EEG was flatline. No dreams, no thoughts, no pain, no awareness, no sentience.

    Twice, the neurologist came to me to ask if I have discussed with the family, chaplins and other dr.s about removing her from life support. She was rated a 3 (the worse possible) on the [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glasgow_Coma_Scale"]Coma Scale[/ame].

    She remained in the coma for 3 weeks.

    She was on a ventilator which was doing 100% of her breathing for her.

    She had catheters for her bodily functions.

    A feeding tube inserted directly into her stomach... (originally she was fed through a tube in her nose)

    She was posturing (feet and hands drawn up like someone with cerebal palsy)

    While she was on the vent, she contracted two infections - Mrsa and [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acinetobacter"]Acinetobacter[/ame] .

    Her prognosis was not a good one at all.

    I share all of this with you as a preface to a really important question. (Important to me, that is... and I hope you will give it some thought before answering.)

    "What doctor would pull the plug on a comatose patient (like my wife) if that patient had even a fraction of the prognosis (forecast) that a pre-birth child has?" [/QUOTE]
    Last edited by Chuz Life; 12-23-09 at 12:53 AM.

  8. #128
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    Question Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    To my poll question, "What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?" Oxymoron,... you responded

    Quote Originally Posted by OxymoronP View Post
    Biological person obviously, and no- the fetus inside the tummy is not a person.
    First question;

    "Is you comment above just an opinion?"

  9. #129
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    Question Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    To my poll question, "What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?" Oxymoron,... you responded

    First question;

    "Is your comment above just an opinion?"
    Why such a narrow time frame for editing a post?

  10. #130
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    Re: What aspect of a person does the Constitution protect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Please provide a reference or source which supports this claim.
    First Amendment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    I'm curious.

    How "aware" do you think my preemie daughter was, when she was born?
    According to you, aware enough to assert her "right to life".

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Two years ago, my wife suffered full cardiac arrest. She required 45 minutes of CPR. She was hit with the defib at least nine times. She lapsed into a coma immediately,... her EEG was flatline. No dreams, no thoughts, no pain, no awareness, no sentience.

    Twice, the neurologist came to me to ask if I have discussed with the family, chaplins and other dr.s about removing her from life support. She was rated a 3 (the worse possible) on the Coma Scale.

    She remained in the coma for 3 weeks.

    She was on a ventilator which was doing 100% of her breathing for her.

    She had catheters for her bodily functions.

    A feeding tube inserted directly into her stomach... (originally she was fed through a tube in her nose)

    She was posturing (feet and hands drawn up like someone with cerebal palsy)

    While she was on the vent, she contracted two infections - Mrsa and Acinetobacter .

    Her prognosis was not a good one at all.

    I share all of this with you as a preface to a really important question. (Important to me, that is... and I hope you will give it some thought before answering.)

    "What doctor would pull the plug on a comatose patient (like my wife) if that patient had even a fraction of the prognosis (forecast) that a pre-birth child has?"
    So what Doctor would abort a pre-birth child if they had next to 0 chance for survival? Well, since they weren't on artificial life support, I'd assume they might try to fix something, and if that didn't work let nature run its course or perform an abortion as per the Mother's wishes, Similar to the person on the life support machine, they would consult the relatives after exhausting the proper avenues.

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