View Poll Results: Does a new person's life "biologically" begin at conception?

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  • Yes

    54 64.29%
  • No

    30 35.71%
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Thread: Does life biologically begin at conception?

  1. #211
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    Question Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    Technically speaking, its simple enough to say that an embryo is alive after it is conceived. However, that is meaningless to the abortion debate. Millions of bacteria live in your skin, and taking a shower is like genocide to them. Life alone has no value to us. The value of a life is completely subjective analysis, and thus evidence is not available.
    Our laws and our Constitution have established the rights that 'persons' and 'ciizens' have to their lives.

    Correct?

  2. #212
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    Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    An Individual's life (regardless of species) biologically begins at conception.

    Agree?
    This is an equivocation of "life".
    1) life - as in "I live my life"
    2) life - as in, a bacteria is "life", bacteria is "alive".

    A human being is "alive" at conception. E.G., a human zygote embryo, fetus, adult is "life" as defined by biologists.

    However, when a human being possesses "a life" as in "a corresponding state, existence, or principle of existence conceived of as belonging to the soul" is NOT a scientific question, it is distinctly different than the biological definition of life. The debate on where "one's life" begins (as opposed to when life biologically begins) is a question of constant debate without an objective answer because the question itself is subjective.

    Chuz repeatedly blurs the line with ambiguous language and/or equivocation (as he has done here), either purposely or ignorantly, on this matter.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

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  3. #213
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    mad Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    This is an equivocation of "life".
    1) life - as in "I live my life"
    2) life - as in, a bacteria is "life", bacteria is "alive".

    A human being is "alive" at conception. E.G., a human zygote embryo, fetus, adult is "life" as defined by biologists.

    However, when a human being possesses "a life" as in "a corresponding state, existence, or principle of existence conceived of as belonging to the soul" is NOT a scientific question, it is distinctly different than the biological definition of life. The debate on where "one's life" begins (as opposed to when life biologically begins) is a question of constant debate without an objective answer because the question itself is subjective.

    Chuz repeatedly blurs the line with ambiguous language and/or equivocation (as he has done here), either purposely or ignorantly, on this matter.
    This rant of yours tells me that you are completely oblivious to my accompanying poll; "What aspect of a person does the Constitution portect?"

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    Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Our laws and our Constitution have established the rights that 'persons' and 'ciizens' have to their lives.

    Correct?
    And the debate is, of course, when do humans become "persons" and "citizens"?

    The Supreme Court has repeatedly ruled, simply being conceived does NOT qualify. The Supreme Court is not an authority on truth nonetheless they are the Supremme Authority when it comes to matters of interpreting the Consitutition.

    Chuz do you have the integrity to ACKNOWLEDGE the Supreme Courts ruling and their REASONING, even though I am sure you disagree?
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

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    Question Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    And the debate is, of course, when do humans become "persons" and "citizens"?

    The Supreme Court has repeatedly ruled, simply being conceived does NOT qualify. The Supreme Court is not an authority on truth nonetheless they are the Supremme Authority when it comes to matters of interpreting the Consitutition.

    Chuz do you have the integrity to ACKNOWLEDGE the Supreme Courts ruling and their REASONING, even though I am sure you disagree?
    Indeed,...

    What other "choice" do I have?

    You have the last word for awhile,.. I gotta long drive in bad weather ahead of me.

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    Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    Indeed,...
    Thank you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    What other "choice" do I have?
    To make a coherent and consistent argument about why:

    1) the Constitution should be interpreted as you believe rather than how the majority of Supreme Court Justices have. This would involve CITING the Supreme Courts reasoning or highlighting dissenting opinions on cases that have involved abortion.

    2) people should ascribe to your position on abortion. This would involve an explanation of why your position on abortion is beneficial, optimal, or some other reason why your position is superior to that others. Since the moral debate is unbounded, that is, because the moral debate has no objective basis for determining what is "right" and "wrong" then this is far more difficult and complex issue.

    Thus far you have blended and blurred many issues and sub-issues rather than targeting them independently and specifically. For example, you have written about when "science has determined life begins" but then don't explain why that is relevant to a moral position on abortion. You instead beg the question, equivocate with words such as "life", invent your own interpretation of the Constitution, or quote some person as an argument to authority.

    Furthermore, you need to ATTEMPT to understand your oppositions position in its STRONGEST form. Perhaps this will give you a different perspective on what your opponents are actually proposing and objecting to. This may give you a better idea of how to attack their arguments then how you have done in the past. So far I haven't seen evidence that you actually comprehend your oppositions position fully.


    Quote Originally Posted by Chuz Life View Post
    You have the last word for awhile,.. I gotta long drive in bad weather ahead of me.
    Drive safely!
    Last edited by scourge99; 12-31-09 at 07:13 PM.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

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    Arrow Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    What choices do I have?
    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    To make a coherent and consistent argument about why:

    1) the Constitution should be interpreted as you believe rather than how the majority of Supreme Court Justices have. This would involve CITING the Supreme Courts reasoning or highlighting dissenting opinions on cases that have involved abortion.
    "The fact that a majority of the States reflecting, after all, the majority sentiment in those States, have had restrictions on abortions for at least a century is a strong indication, it seems to me, that the asserted right to an abortion is not "so rooted in the traditions and conscience of our people as to be ranked as fundamental," Snyder v. Massachusetts, 291 U.S. 97, 105 (1934). Even today, when society's views on abortion are changing, the very existence of the debate is evidence that the "right" to an abortion is not so universally accepted as the appellant would have us believe. " Justice William Rehnquist- dissenting,... Roe v. Wade

    Yeah,.. the same William Rehnquist who would later become Chief Justice of the Supreme Court.

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    2) people should ascribe to your position on abortion. This would involve an explanation of why your position on abortion is beneficial, optimal, or some other reason why your position is superior to that others. Since the moral debate is unbounded, that is, because the moral debate has no objective basis for determining what is "right" and "wrong" then this is far more difficult and complex issue.
    I prefer to do what I do,... as I have been for years. The trend in the country is shifting away from abortion on demand and towards a more anti-abortion posture.

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    Thus far you have blended and blurred many issues and sub-issues rather than targeting them independently and specifically. For example, you have written about when "science has determined life begins" but then don't explain why that is relevant to a moral position on abortion. You instead beg the question, equivocate with words such as "life", invent your own interpretation of the Constitution, or quote some person as an argument to authority.
    I'm content with people filling in the 'morality' blanks for themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    Furthermore, you need to ATTEMPT to understand your oppositions position in its STRONGEST form. Perhaps this will give you a different perspective on what your opponents are actually proposing and objecting to. This may give you a better idea of how to attack their arguments then how you have done in the past. So far I haven't seen evidence that you actually comprehend your oppositions position fully.
    1) I used to be pro-choice on abortion myself.

    2) What I 'need' is fewer people telling me what I need. And I doubt very much your critique is actually geared to aid me in any of the ways you suggest.

    If you can do it better than me,.. do it.

    Barring that,... How would you like a nice big cup of,.....

  8. #218
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    Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    If life does not begin at conception, then it never begins.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    IMO a Sperm is not alive.
    But the original question was Life beginning at conception, to which i answered 'Yes'

    We were not asked to vote on whether that was intelligent Life or even life that was 'aware', merely the onset of Life.

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    Exclamation Re: Does life biologically begin at conception?

    Quote Originally Posted by jujuman13 View Post
    IMO a Sperm is not alive.
    But the original question was Life beginning at conception, to which i answered 'Yes'

    We were not asked to vote on whether that was intelligent Life or even life that was 'aware', merely the onset of Life.
    This is correct,.. and it is also the very aspect that leads to the question in my other (accompanying) poll;

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...n-protect.html

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