View Poll Results: Should counselors be allowed to refuse treatment that violate their morals?

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  • Absolutely not! This is flagrant discrimination!

    10 28.57%
  • They should attend diversity and tolerance seminars to educate them

    3 8.57%
  • Patients should chose the counselor who suits them

    2 5.71%
  • They should be required to refer the patient to the appropriate colleague

    7 20.00%
  • They should refuse any patient they don't want to treat!

    13 37.14%
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Thread: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

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    Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    A Christian counselor in Britain got sacked because he refused to counsel a gay couple regarding their sex life. Do you think this should be allowed? Should insurance agencies, or the government, force counselors to provide mental health services that violate their individual religious and/or moral codes?

    Christian counsellor who refused to offer sex advice to gay couples fails in religious discrimination claim | Mail Online

    A Christian relationship counsellor who lost his job after refusing to provide sex therapy to gay couples has failed in a further attempt to prove religious discrimination by his former employers.

    Gary McFarlane, 48, a former elder in a church in Hanham, Bristol, lost his fight at the Employment Appeal Tribunal (EAT) in London to prove discrimination by the relationship charity Relate.

    His appeal was launched after an employment tribunal ruled in January that he had been wrongfully dismissed by Relate in March last year but had not been a victim of religious discrimination or unfair dismissal.

    Read more: Christian counsellor who refused to offer sex advice to gay couples fails in religious discrimination claim | Mail Online

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    A Christian counselor in Britain got sacked because he refused to counsel a gay couple regarding their sex life. Do you think this should be allowed? Should insurance agencies, or the government, force counselors to provide mental health services that violate their individual religious and/or moral codes?

    Christian counsellor who refused to offer sex advice to gay couples fails in religious discrimination claim | Mail Online
    No. The government has no business interfering in the religious beliefs of others.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    My concern here is, will the introduction of a more universal, government sponsored healthcare in the United States lead to this type of infringement of individual rights here?

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    A Christian counselor in Britain got sacked because he refused to counsel a gay couple regarding their sex life. Do you think this should be allowed? Should insurance agencies, or the government, force counselors to provide mental health services that violate their individual religious and/or moral codes?

    Christian counsellor who refused to offer sex advice to gay couples fails in religious discrimination claim | Mail Online
    First of all, who goes to a christian sex counselor? I mean seriously wtf is that? Further, what gay couple goes to a christian counselor? Wtf did you expect to hear other than "well of course you're having trouble in bed homosexuality is a disorder/sin/etc".

    Secondly, yeah, let professionals of every kind give a referral to someone who will give the service if they'd rather.
    Last edited by Jerry; 11-30-09 at 11:49 PM.

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    First of all, who goes to a christian sex counselor? I mean seriously wtf is that? Further, what gay couple goes to a christian counselor? Wtf did you expect to hear other than "well of course you're having trouble in bed homosexuality is a disorder/sin/etc".

    Secondly, yeah, let professionals of every kind give a referral to someone who will give the service if they'd rather.
    This is in the United Kingdom under the NHS. The government has a big say in all health services.

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    Companies should have the right to conduct their business as they see fit for the most part.

    If someone is in the business is to run counseling for couples (regardless of the sexual make-up of the relationship), then the employer should be free to fire somebody who is insubordinate to the company philosophy.


    Now this is a charity. It really doesn't matter though...


    This man's case makes about as much sense as a Satanist working for a church charity who refuses to do work on behalf of the Lord & takes issue with their termination for failure to comply.

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    I'm wondering why, with the diversity of humans, that there aren't enough counselors of varying philosophical approaches to match the needs of various clients? Why not make a bit of extra effort to accommodate everyone?

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    A Christian relationship counsellor who lost his job after refusing to provide sex therapy to gay couples has failed in a further attempt to prove religious discrimination by his former employers.
    A Christian counselor in Britain got sacked because he refused to counsel a gay couple regarding their sex life. Do you think this should be allowed?
    Why shouldn't it be allowed?
    I'd fire him too.
    He has been hired as a relationship counsellor and he failed to carry out what he was paid to do because of his own prejudiced views.
    Last edited by Laila; 12-01-09 at 02:16 AM.

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    Does the individual counselor have the right to refuse seeing clients for whatever reason? Yes, he sure does. And the government has no business butting in. But does the counselor's employer have the right to fire him if his personal standards conflict with the employer's standards and the image they want to project? Yes, they do.

    The man is not being fired due to his religious beliefs, but because he refuses to conform to their standards and practices. The fact that his refusal is based on his religious beliefs is irrelevant.
    Slipping into madness is good for the sake of comparison - Unknown.

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    Re: Should a Christian counselor be allowed to refuse to counsel gay couples?

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    A Christian counselor in Britain got sacked because he refused to counsel a gay couple regarding their sex life. Do you think this should be allowed?
    Definitely. In fact he should have been sued, not just fired.

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    Should insurance agencies, or the government, force counselors to provide mental health services that violate their individual religious and/or moral codes?
    Not if my "moral codes" (or lack thereof in this guy's case) violate the requirements of my workplace. If that's a problem with me, then I'll just have to find another job.

    What if a Muslim man thinks he should have a "right" to an extra break time each day just to pray to Mecca (which other employees don't get)?

    What if an Amish person takes a job at Pizza Hut and thinks he has a "right" to deliver pizza in a horse and buggy because "it's his religion"?

    What if a transgendered person thinks he should have a "right" to violate company dresscode and dress up like a woman on the clock because "it's my individual rights!"

    What if a Muslim woman thinks she has a "right" to wear a veil on her drivers' license photo or employee ID badge because "it's my religion"?

    What if a devout Catholic joins the military, but refuses to deploy to Afganistan because he believes his religion commands him not to kill and cites his deployment as "violating his religious' rights"?

    etc etc...

    Justice is served. Morals are prevailing while religious insanity is deteriorating. All good to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by MyOwnDrum View Post
    My concern here is, will the introduction of a more universal, government sponsored healthcare in the United States lead to this type of infringement of individual rights here?
    ...uh not that I'm aware of, unless the govt healthcare system hires a bunch of fundie Christian counselors. I don't think you'll have to worry about more guys like this wacko getting jobs. If anything, they'll be less likely to seek govt. jobs.
    Last edited by Toothpicvic; 12-01-09 at 03:18 AM.

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