View Poll Results: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

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    41 47.67%
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    40 46.51%
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Thread: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

  1. #221
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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Its the topic under discusion.
    See: title of topic
    1. If marriage is a right then the States are in violation of the constitution.

    2. If marriage is a privilege then the States are in violation of the constitution.

    You yourself stated it was a privilege :

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    This, alone, means that marriage is a privilege, not a right, as rights exist independent of an act of creation by the government.
    The fact that you choose to define gay marriage as being any different than marriage is a weak distraction. No different than trying to create a difference between interracial marriage and white-white marriage or black-black marriage.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    No, I am just stating facts.

    States rights are one of the core values this nation was founded under.
    And it's the reason we had a civil war, Jim crow laws, abuses of the 1st amendment, lynchings of whites, blacks, Asians etc. Forgive me if I don't respect those 'values'.

    Of course you seem to like Federal Government involvement and entitlement in every aspect of peoples lives, so oh well.
    No. I don't buy into the justification that made people slaves.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    1. If marriage is a right then the States are in violation of the constitution.

    2. If marriage is a privilege then the States are in violation of the constitution.
    This is all irrelevant to the question of if Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S. -- the question asked in the poll and thus the topic at hand.

    You yourself stated it was a privilege
    Yes, I did, as that was my answer to the question asked by the poll.

    The fact that you choose to define gay marriage as being any different than marriage is a weak distraction. No different than trying to create a difference between interracial marriage and white-white marriage or black-black marriage.
    Irrelevant to the topic under consideration.

  4. #224
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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    And it's the reason we had a civil war, Jim crow laws, abuses of the 1st amendment, lynchings of whites, blacks, Asians etc. Forgive me if I don't respect those 'values'.
    Jim Crow started AFTER the civil war and had nothing to do with it. Lynchings again started AFTER the civil war and again had nothing to do with it.

    Slavery was one of many issues that started the Civil war.

    You mite want to bone up on some history and leave the afro-centric bull**** at home.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    No. I don't buy into the justification that made people slaves.
    It had nothing to do with it. It was an accepted practice in that time. You are trying to judge them by a practice that was legitimate and legal then.

    Nice fallacy argument, nothing more.
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  5. #225
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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    This is all irrelevant to the question of if Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S. -- the question asked in the poll and thus the topic at hand.

    Yes, I did, as that was my answer to the question asked by the poll.

    Irrelevant to the topic under consideration.
    Do you not understand that gay marriage is no different than black-black marriage, interracial marriage, white-white marriage etc. and the question on the topic is a distraction? Of course you don't. Because you're part of the distraction and it is your favor to continue this silly game of 'it's not really marriage!'

    Defining a particular form of marriage(a contract by two individuals) as 'gay' or 'interracial' does not deny the fact that it is still marriage as proven by Loving V. Virginia. Not only that, regardless of whether you define marriage as a constitutional right or a privilege, the states do not have legal power to deny it.

    The OPs question is a distraction.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Do you not understand that gay marriage is no different than black-black marriage....
    Do you not undertsand that none of that is in any way relevant to the question at hand, the topic that said question creates or my response to same?

  7. #227
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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Jim Crow started AFTER the civil war and had nothing to do with it.
    Who said differently(as far as starting after the civil war?)? And of course Jim Crow had to do with States rights. That you don't know this is ridiculous

    Lynchings again started AFTER the civil war and again had nothing to do with it.
    Entirely related. It is as related as the KKK is to the Civil war, Southern poverty etc.

    Slavery was one of many issues that started the Civil war.
    Most prevalent one as justified by the 4 states who issued legal documents for siding with the South, the Vice President of the Confederacy and many other legal documents of the time.

    You mite want to bone up on some history and leave the afro-centric bull**** at home.
    I think I touched a bone.

    It had nothing to do with it. It was an accepted practice in that time. You are trying to judge them by a practice that was legitimate and legal then.

    Nice fallacy argument, nothing more.
    Irrelevant. The states defended their perceived 'right' to own slaves. This ridiculous perception people have that 'States rights' is anything other than Dixiecrat-Republican-Southern double speak falls flat on it's face when one looks at the history of the term 'State's rights'.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/States%27_rights#Civil_War

    Over the following decades, another central dispute over states' rights moved to the fore. The issue of slavery polarized the union, with the Jeffersonian principles often being used by both sides—anti-slavery Northerners, and Southern slaveholders and secessionists—in debates that ultimately led to the American Civil War. Supporters of slavery often argued that one of the rights of the states was the protection of slave property wherever it went, a position endorsed by the U.S. Supreme Court in the 1857 Dred Scott decision. In contrast, opponents of slavery argued that the non-slave-states' rights were violated both by that decision and by the Fugitive Slave Law of 1850. Exactly which—and whose—states' rights were the casus belli in the Civil War remain in controversy.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/States%...22code_word.22

    The term "states' rights," some have argued,[11] was used as a code word by defenders of segregation.[citation needed] It was the official name of the "Dixiecrat" party led by white supremacist presidential candidate Strom Thurmond.[12][13] George Wallace, the Alabama governor—who famously declared in his inaugural address, "Segregation now! Segregation tomorrow! Segregation forever!"—later remarked that he should have said, "States' rights now! States' rights tomorrow! States' rights forever!"[citation needed] Wallace, however, claimed that segregation was but one issue symbolic of a larger struggle for states' rights; in that view, which some historians dispute, his replacement of segregation with states' rights would be more of a clarification than a euphemism.[14]
    Seriously. Don't question my knowledge of the Civil rights. You'll lose. Really fast.
    Last edited by Hatuey; 10-20-09 at 12:46 PM.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  8. #228
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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Do you not undertsand that none of that is in any way relevant to the question at hand, the topic that said question creates or my response to same?
    As you've already stated, marriage ,is a privilege. It doesn't have to be declared a right for it to be undeniable by the States. Your refusal to understand that gay marriage is marriage is see through.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    As you've already stated, marriage ,is a privilege.
    That's correct.
    Did you have an argument against this, or were you going to continue to go off-topic?
    Last edited by Goobieman; 10-20-09 at 12:47 PM.

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    Re: Is Gay Marriage a Constitutional Right in the U.S.?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    That's correct.
    And therefor any question of it being 'a Constitutional right' is irrelevant. It can not be denied by the States under the Constitution.

    Did you have an argument against this, or were you going to continue to go off-topic?
    Note specifically that while a state may allow same-sex couples to marry, this marriage need not be recognized by other states, and is NOT recognized by the federal government.
    The rest of your post is a contradiction with the first part. Did you forget that? If a state recognizes marriage, and marriage is a privilege, then constitutionally it can not deny it to gay couples and must recognize it as proven by Loving V. Virginia.
    Last edited by Hatuey; 10-20-09 at 12:51 PM.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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