View Poll Results: Does the original intent still matter when discussing the Constitution?

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  • Yes. We should strictly follow both the letter and spirit of the original intent.

    28 35.90%
  • Yes. We should follow the original principles and then apply them as new issues arise.

    21 26.92%
  • Yes. The original intent of the Constition is important, but other factors must be considered.

    15 19.23%
  • No. The Constitution is a guiding set of principles that we can interrpret to fit our current needs.

    10 12.82%
  • Other

    4 5.13%
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Thread: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

  1. #91
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Crunch View Post
    Has it escaped your notice that the US is also the freest country in the world and has the best standard of living? I wonder if the two go hand in hand.
    Actually the US is not at the top of the list by either of those measures...but regardless, there are lots of free/prosperous countries with constitutions that are much easier to amend. Hell, Israel and the UK don't even have constitutions at all.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 10-14-09 at 05:21 PM.
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    And how could the constitution cover something that effectively wasn't an issue back then?
    If laws needed to be passed by the federal gov't that went beyond the restrictions under the constitution, then an amendment should have been passed to allow them.

  3. #93
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by other View Post
    If laws needed to be passed by the federal gov't that went beyond the restrictions under the constitution, then an amendment should have been passed to allow them.
    Good luck. When was the last time an amendment about anything important passed?
    The Makeout Hobo is real, and does indeed travel around the country in his van and make out with ladies... If you meet the Makeout Hobo, it is customary to greet him with a shot of whiskey and a high five (if you are a dude) or passionate makeouts (if you are a lady).

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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    Good luck. When was the last time an amendment about anything important passed?
    Important to you, or important to me? The amendment process is designed to ensure that most agree so changes can't be made arbitrarily on a whim.

    I asked earlier what you thought needed to be fixed with the constitution as-is...what do you feel needs to be changed right now?

  5. #95
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    Dude, I posted more in that post that I thought was responding to your position. Did you not read it or something?
    Just ignore him, this is Goobieman's MO. His rallying cry is "You didn't respond to my point," which he usually utters immediately after someone responds to his point (if he made one at all). I wouldn't be surprised to see him say "You didn't respond to my point" on the first post he makes in the thread.

    I generally just respond to him until he starts pulling that crap, then ignore him and talk with people who are actually debating intelligently.
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  6. #96
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    And how could the constitution cover something that effectively wasn't an issue back then?
    State issue, not a Federal issue.

    Pretty simple.

    The Federal Governments power was supposed to be limited.
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by other View Post
    Important to you, or important to me? The amendment process is designed to ensure that most agree so changes can't be made arbitrarily on a whim.

    I asked earlier what you thought needed to be fixed with the constitution as-is...what do you feel needs to be changed right now?
    Something that wasn't procedural, like Congressional raises, or the Order of Succession.

    Well, I need to do some things before my date with the lovely Rose, so I'll catch you guys later
    The Makeout Hobo is real, and does indeed travel around the country in his van and make out with ladies... If you meet the Makeout Hobo, it is customary to greet him with a shot of whiskey and a high five (if you are a dude) or passionate makeouts (if you are a lady).

  8. #98
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    And how could the constitution cover something that effectively wasn't an issue back then?
    By being amended of course.... remember that?

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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Actually the US is not at the top of the list by either of those measures...but regardless, there are lots of free/prosperous countries with constitutions that are much easier to amend. Hell, Israel and the UK don't even have constitutions at all.
    Sure it is, unless you go by something as biased against the US as the UN is, then of course Cuba has more freedom and a better medical system.

  10. #100
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    Re: The Constitution: Does Original Intent Still Matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by the makeout hobo View Post
    I think limiting our framework to what a few people decided a few hundred years ago is limiting, and gives us no room to change with new technology.
    This is patenetly false.
    See article V - the amendment process.

    I also posit that they didn't all always agree on what things meant, there were some parts that they ratified after much debate and disagreement, and other parts they didn't debate at all so there's not a lot of documentation to go off of.
    They may not have all agreed on the all of particul;ars, but that doesnt invalidate my argument - they DID have a particular logic and reasoning that created the working context for the document.

    The 'problems' you might find with the Constitution occour when you try to go outside that context. This isnt a problem inherent in original intent, this is a problem inherent with doing someting that the fed Gvmtn was never meant to do.

    If you want it to do someting outside that context, you are free to amend it.

    We need to also remember that some things they'd have no answer for because it didn't exist back then. I mean, labor laws didn't exist back then because there was no real industry, for instance.
    Not sure you how think this (and all kinds of other things) are not covered by the Constitition -- there's clearly the power to regulate interstate commerce, and, beyond that, the recognition that any additional necessary power belong to the states.

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