View Poll Results: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car?

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  • Yes. The rule against weapons on campus needs to be enforced! What sort of message does that send?

    3 4.84%
  • He should have gotten less time since it wasn't a very deadly weapon and his intent was not violent

    3 4.84%
  • I'm not sure about this one...

    0 0%
  • He should have had a warning.

    7 11.29%
  • What is wrong with school official these days? Seriously, this is ridiculous!

    49 79.03%
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Thread: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car?

  1. #91
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    Then why haven't the student been expelled?

    The level of punishment denotes the level of offense. It's obvious the level of offense is minimal, and therefore did not require expulsion.
    In what universe is a 20 day suspension minimal?

    Please point out where in any article it says it is the minimum punishment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    But you, nor I, know anything about what the administrators are discussing. I don't know what facts you are using to determine that intent was not considered. All I have is speculation, and as far as I can tell, so are you.
    What part of "Zero tolerance does not take into account intent" are you missing? This is a fact. In my opinion he should be getting no punishment at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    Where does it say that it's not the minimum?
    Common sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    Exactly, so how do you know intent was ignored?
    Because he would not be getting a 20 days suspension or anything else for that matter. What part of "locked in his car in a case" are you missing? You did bother to read the article correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    If the student was given the minimum punishment, then I think they've considered the intent. If 20 days is the minimum, then I think the punishment, while being harsh, is as best as it's going to get for the time being (until they reform it).
    So now the minimum is "harsh?"

    Oh the irony.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  2. #92
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    Right, so we're talking about the level of punishment.

    If the 20 days was the minimum, then I think the action taken was the most appropriate action to take, albeit still too harsh.
    Again for the hundredth time it is not by any means a minimum.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    Look, I think it was way too harsh. But if the school needed to give the minimum level of punishment then their hands are tied because of the zero-tolerance policy. And I acknowledge this fault.
    If there was no zero tolerence policy, none of this would have been an issue in the first place. But I see why you tried to defend it...

    "I don't think zero-tolerance policy are always bad. - Lightdemon
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  3. #93
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    In what universe is a 20 day suspension minimal?

    Please point out where in any article it says it is the minimum punishment?
    Sigh....I already told you. I don't know if that was the minimum. I'm saying, IF the minimum was 20 days, then the action taken by the school was the appropriate action taken.

    I think I may have said something that got you mad or something, and you're just not listening to a thing I'm saying. I'm sorry if I did that, but please try to at least read my words properly.

    What part of "Zero tolerance does not take into account intent" are you missing?
    And I'm telling you that intent was considered because of the fact that the boy scout was not expelled. The fact that he was not given maximum punishment. The fact that he was given something less than maximum means that there was some sort of discretion implicated when deciding what his punishment was to be.

    Common sense.
    Sorry, but that provides no substantiation on your part.

    Because he would not be getting a 20 days suspension or anything else for that matter. What part of "locked in his car in a case" are you missing? You did bother to read the article correct?
    And what if the 20 days was the minimum??

    So now the minimum is "harsh?"

    Oh the irony.
    What do you think I've been saying all this time??

    Like I said, I think you may be confused...
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

  4. #94
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Did you need a knife? Did you even have to take off the cover to repair it?
    I needed a very small screwdriver that can fit in a cramped space. Unless you have a very complete screwdriver set, a multi-tool is what you use.

    When's the last time you had public school cafeteria food?
    Why do you think I was bringing the bread and cheese?

    I'm pretty sure scissors can handle that...
    Not practically, especially with the small scissors that schools use.

    Anything can be used as a weapon. I don't have to demonstrate specifically how a pocket knife can be a danger because damn near everything can be a weapon. What I said was this: I do not want any weapons on campus if it can be prevented.
    Why? What is wrong with having practical tools that aren't particularly dangerous?

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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Again for the hundredth time it is not by any means a minimum.
    Show me where in the school policy that it specifically states that 20 days suspension is not the minimum penalty for bringing a weapon to campus.

    Until you do, you, nor I, have any idea what the minimum penalty is.

    If there was no zero tolerence policy, none of this would have been an issue in the first place. But I see why you tried to defend it...

    "I don't think zero-tolerance policy are always bad. - Lightdemon
    It's quite obvious that you're angered, I don't understand why, but I apologize.
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

  6. #96
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    How are you comparing organized sports and pocket knives?? I don't understand.
    Organized sports are somewhat dangerous. Every year, kids get injuries from playing them that range from minor to terminal. However, sports are encourage, even funded by schools. If you are so determined to protect kids from everything, why wouldn't you start with a clear cause of injury? Pocket knives hurt a lot less kids every year than football or soccer.

    Anything can be a weapon.
    Not practically. Using that as a justification for a ban is absurd. You could ban anything you felt like using such logic.

  7. #97
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    I needed a very small screwdriver that can fit in a cramped space. Unless you have a very complete screwdriver set, a multi-tool is what you use.
    I'm not saying this to offend, but as a teacher the last person I want repairing my computer is a high school student. Not because of the lack of expertise (as most high school students don't know how to repair computers), but also because of liability. The appropriate action the teacher should have taken was to consult the campus IT technician.

    Why do you think I was bringing the bread and cheese?
    This made me laugh, thx.

    Why? What is wrong with having practical tools that aren't particularly dangerous?
    As practical as it may be, it's really unnecessary to carry the pocket knife.
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

  8. #98
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    Organized sports are somewhat dangerous. Every year, kids get injuries from playing them that range from minor to terminal. However, sports are encourage, even funded by schools. If you are so determined to protect kids from everything, why wouldn't you start with a clear cause of injury? Pocket knives hurt a lot less kids every year than football or soccer.
    I'm not trying to protect kids from everything. I'm trying to eliminate unneeded risks. Again, what I said was this: I do not want any weapons on campus if it can be prevented. I'll amend it to this for better accuracy:

    I do not want any danger on campus if it can be prevented.

    How's that?

    Not practically. Using that as a justification for a ban is absurd. You could ban anything you felt like using such logic.
    But you already know what I meant, I've explained it elsewhere already. There are tools that have it's place in a classroom, and tools that do not have a place. Just because it can be used as a weapon was not my only criteria, and you know this.
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

  9. #99
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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    I'm not saying this to offend, but as a teacher the last person I want repairing my computer is a high school student. Not because of the lack of expertise (as most high school students don't know how to repair computers), but also because of liability. The appropriate action the teacher should have taken was to consult the campus IT technician.
    In the world where obnoxious bureaucrats rule, that is the case . However, my teacher trusted in my skills enough to risk it rather than wait a week to get it fixed. Its a sad reflection of our society when such inefficient and pointless behavior becomes expected.

    This made me laugh, thx.
    So did everyone else when I tried to cut my baguette with a plastic knife.

    As practical as it may be, it's really unnecessary to carry the pocket knife.
    Perhaps, but it isn't necessary to punish people for carrying them either.

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    Re: Should this Eagle Scout have been suspended for keeping 2" pocketknife in his car

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    Perhaps, but it isn't necessary to punish people for carrying them either.
    If there wasn't a zero-tolerance policy, I don't think so either. But because there is a zero-tolerance policy established, I would want the school to choose the minimum level of punishment for the violation. If it's 20 days, then the school has done right by me.
    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Let the public school provide the basics, you as the parent can do the fine tuning.

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