View Poll Results: Do you want the United States to decriminalize all drugs?

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  • Yes

    32 53.33%
  • No

    22 36.67%
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Thread: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

  1. #91
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    By the same token, being able to do drugs isn't a right either. The constitution is entirely silent on the matter. Therefore, arguing that people have a right to do drugs is absurd.

    Secondly, the size of the market is irrelevant. If you want to substitute speeding for murder, we can do that too. There are many, many, many more people who speed than do drugs. Should we abolish all speed limits on every road in the nation because people will just do it anyhow?
    If one doesn't have full control of what does to oneself then you aren't living free. That's why I smoke and did even tried crack for a couple of weeks in the past. ****ing hell. I even chugged large amounts of Robitussin. And that **** is legal and did the worst to me. I would NEVER ever trick anyone into putting this **** into their body though. If only we knew what business men with sway sneak into our body. For stubborn people when you say "You can't do this." It only makes it more enticing. Applying their own personal code of honor of course.

    Speed limits happen to affect people other than you very commonly. You are violating little Suzy's being when she is walking to the street from her house and taking a path behind a van. And you scream around a corner and take her out going 80 in a residential. The seize of a market is incredibly important. It goes to show you that there is a huge want for it. If all this large group of people want to do is stick **** in there body and feel better why do you gotta be a happiness cock blocker?
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  2. #92
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Should we abolish all speed limits on every road in the nation because people will just do it anyhow?
    In non-urban areas, yes. Montana did it for years without repercussions.

    In 1999, after 4 years of no numerical or posted daytime speed limit on these classifications of highways, outside of urban areas, Montana recorded its lowest fatality rate.

    Research scientists and engineers have long known that there are sometimes unexpected results from changes in public policies. Ironically, the paradox of no posted speed limits and low fatalities is no surprise to the traffic safety engineering community.

    For years, motorists' advocates have used engineering-based facts against artificially low speed limits. They have claimed that by raising speed limits to reasonable levels, accident and fatality rates will actually be reduced. This seemingly wild assertion has been documented by the traffic engineering profession for 50 plus years. This fact-based position has again been proven to be true by the repeal of the National Speed Limit. The nation has recorded the lowest highway fatality rate since such records have been kept.

    What about the extreme of No Speed Limits on 4 lane Interstate and rural federal-aid primary two lane highways? These same fact-based engineers point to the German Autobahn, where, with no speed limits, authorities are consistently reporting lower fatality rates than comparable US highways

  3. #93
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Because they're already legal. There's a difference between making an existing legal thing illegal and legalizing something that is illegal.



    Except that... it's not. While the direct impact of drug use may be on the individual, society carries the cost of widespread drug use.



    Which is simply not the case. People can't speed because they want to. People can't just do what they want.
    Without a doubt, the societal cost of the war on drugs has far outweighed the benefits. Not only does it create a black market (where a variety of market efficiencies are completely removed), it puts regulation/control in the hands of people that are willing to murder for money.

    Of course we hear of this sparingly, where a business partner has another killed to protect their market share. The difference is, when you push it to a black market, the likelihood of crimes involved in the industry being reported diminishes greatly. Instead of a business man calling the police when someone breaks in to steal his "stuff", he will act in a vigilante demeanor, and go about protecting his "turf" in the fashion of Al Capone.

    The societal cost of prohibition (bootlegging kingpins) far outweighed the benefits (decreased quantity supplied at a lower price level). Not only does it create demand pull inflation, which draws specie into the industry in an inefficient fashion, but it creates a spillover effect in terms of cost of policing, murder, higher prison populations (another cost to society relative to a legalization policy), etc....
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  4. #94
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    In non-urban areas, yes. Montana did it for years without repercussions.
    And the Autobahn does it, but in neither cases is it unrestricted everywhere. Both Montana and Germany recognize that there have to be limits, which I said from the start.
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    If one doesn't have full control of what does to oneself then you aren't living free.
    No such thing as complete freedom, sorry. Not unless you're off living by yourself somewhere at least. When you take part in a society, you trade some of your freedom for overall security and ease of existence. Interacting with others means you have to have some self-control, either imposed by yourself or imposed on you by others.

    Don't like that, go find a deserted island somewhere that you can live by yourself and fend entirely for yourself. That's the only way you're ever going to get that illusory freedom you seem to crave.
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  6. #96
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    No such thing as complete freedom, sorry. Not unless you're off living by yourself somewhere at least. When you take part in a society, you trade some of your freedom for overall security and ease of existence. Interacting with others means you have to have some self-control, either imposed by yourself or imposed on you by others.

    Don't like that, go find a deserted island somewhere that you can live by yourself and fend entirely for yourself. That's the only way you're ever going to get that illusory freedom you seem to crave.
    Or you could just quite being a happiness cockblocker. Whats wrong with respecting anything one does to oneself in private as long as it affects no others directly? If I wanted to chop off my own hand it should be legal. Would be incredibly stupid and pointless. But its mine to alter. Not yours. Not the governments. Not my mommy and daddy.

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  7. #97
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Per the OP, we are only concerning ourselves with the specific drugs legalized by Mexico, to the minimal extent Mexico is now allowing personal possession of those specific drugs.
    nice attempt at reframing the discussion how you want to.. per the OP:

    Quote Originally Posted by OP
    Hello Everybody

    Do you want the United States to decriminalize all drugs & why?
    Last edited by marduc; 10-15-09 at 06:00 PM.
    Law Enforcement Against Prohibition
    Drugs are bad, prohibition is worse

  8. #98
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    To some degree, yes, it actually is.

    If you are a danger to yourself or others, the local authority needs to step in and protect you, even from yourself.

    That is a valid state interest.

    The one who's wrong is you for wanting to harm yourself, not the state for trying to keep you safe.
    Nanny statism much? Why is it the federal government's responsibility to stop you from yourself? Why can't adult's make bad decisions for themselves? Paternalism isn't a good policy, because if people can can't be free to fail, than they can't be free at all. The Federal government controls their lives when it isn't their place

  9. #99
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    Or you could just quite being a happiness cockblocker. Whats wrong with respecting anything one does to oneself in private as long as it affects no others directly? If I wanted to chop off my own hand it should be legal. Would be incredibly stupid and pointless. But its mine to alter. Not yours. Not the governments. Not my mommy and daddy.
    But it's not legal, like it or not. You cannot choose to go to a doctor and mutilate yourself, no matter who it affects. You can't even attempt to kill yourself in most places. You can think it's stupid and pointless, but I think most things libertarians want are stupid and pointless. Who gets to decide which is right?

    Oh wait, society does and you, by agreeing to be a part of society, implicitly agree to follow it's rules or suffer the consequences.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  10. #100
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    Re: Mexico Decriminalizes All Drugs!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    By the same token, being able to do drugs isn't a right either. The constitution is entirely silent on the matter. Therefore, arguing that people have a right to do drugs is absurd.
    I said that people have a right to fail. This falls under a right to liberty. They therefore have a right to screw up their life without infringing on other's rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Secondly, the size of the market is irrelevant. If you want to substitute speeding for murder, we can do that too. There are many, many, many more people who speed than do drugs. Should we abolish all speed limits on every road in the nation because people will just do it anyhow?
    No it's not. The black market for murder, a crime with actual victims, doesn't create many too many more problems than murder because the market is small. Drugs are big business, that many more are willing to get into.

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