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Is It Possible To Seal Our Borders?

Is It Possible To Seal Our Borders?

  • Yes

    Votes: 31 52.5%
  • No

    Votes: 28 47.5%

  • Total voters
    59
Baralis said:
I for one would be ok with it on a moral basis. Financially ok with it would be another matter.

Do you agree with the existence of the Berlin wall, then?
 
Do you agree with the existence of the Berlin wall, then?

No because of a very big difference between the two. A wall with mexico would be to keep invaders out, the berlin wall was to also keep legal citizens in.

Its not alot different the putting up a security fence around your property. If you erect a fence to protect your property from outside threats it is legal. If you erect that same fence with the intent to hold someone agaisnt there will its a totally different matter.
 
Yes, and it was heavily manned, plus they shot on site.Much smaller border too.


That is not a problem. Border guards make around 40-80 thousand a year depending on years of service, soldier starting out as E-1 $16,794.00 - O-10 $176,256 a year.
 
No, the military can only defend from Armies, not from a dozen folks on a huge border.

The border's total length is 3,169 km (1,969 miles),

The region along the boundary is characterized by deserts, rugged mountains, abundant sunshine, and two major rivers — the Colorado and the Rio Grande (Río Bravo del Norte) —

To enforce a full closure of the border would require around 30000 Militart personal, including Helicopters, Humvees, Unmanned drones etc etc. The cost of this would be large and this would have to continue forever. Thus the cost would increase annually.
 
To enforce a full closure of the border would require around 30000 Militart personal, including Helicopters, Humvees, Unmanned drones etc etc. The cost of this would be large and this would have to continue forever. Thus the cost would increase annually.

Just increase taxes. :)
 
You would be happy with a Berlin-style wall across the entire US-Mexico border?

Yes. There is a difference between trying prevent legal citizens from leaving and keeping out trespassers.
 
To enforce a full closure of the border would require around 30000 Militart personal,

I agree with you sentiments but think you fall far short of the personnel that would actually be required. (To be honest, I don't think that if we deputized every man, woman & child in this country.......stood them at the borders...facing out......Never let them sleep...eat or goto the bathroom.......That we would have even 1/2 of the personnel necessary.:lol:
 
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I agree with you sentiments but think you fall far short of the personnel that would actually be required. (To be honest, I don't think that if we deputized every man, woman & child in this country.......stood them at the borders...facing out......That we would have 1/2 of the personnel necessary.:lol:

Well based on my calculations if you place a soldier every 1/4 mile, 6000 would be enough. Then you need to have shifts, and support personal, and Officers and detention facilities with guards. I think it could be done with 30000 overall perhaps a bit more. I could be wrong in my math though. Plus if you add Helicopters and Unmanned drones and other detection equipment that number could be reduced.
 
I think Canada, Mexico and USA should Unite and stop the failure borders.
 
The border's total length is 3,169 km (1,969 miles),


If there are any mathematicians in the group, maybe they could calculate something for us:

Divide the above stated border length by the population of this country & then figure how far apart they would have to stand to watch the entire border, we could get an idea of how well such a plan would work. (of course, to be realistic......you would have to divide the population # by 1/3 to allow for only 8 hour working shifts)
 
.....Point???

Hiring the required personal would not be that costly.$400,000,000 a year for 10,000 border guards, $800,000,000 a year for 20,000 border guards, $1,600,000,000 a year for 40,000 border guards thats 20 people for every mile on the southern border. Using soldiers would be cheaper. California spends roughly around 4-5 billion on state services for illegals.
 
Well based on my calculations if you place a soldier every 1/4 mile, 6000 would be enough. Then you need to have shifts, and support personal, and Officers and detention facilities with guards. I think it could be done with 30000 overall perhaps a bit more. I could be wrong in my math though. Plus if you add Helicopters and Unmanned drones and other detection equipment that number could be reduced.

Let's assume your figures are correct. If any illegals slip into the country, we would then need a separate police force to deal with them inland. Since 1878, the Posse Comitatus Act has prohibited ...."federal military personnel and units of the National Guard under federal authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States, except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or Congress. The Coast Guard is exempt from the Act during peacetime."
[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act]Posse Comitatus Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

So now we need a separate...HUGE police force to deal with the illegals we don't stop at the border!:lol:
 
Hiring the required personal would not be that costly.$400,000,000 a year for 10,000 border guards, $800,000,000 a year for 20,000 border guards, $1,600,000,000 a year for 40,000 border guards thats 20 people for every mile on the southern border. Using soldiers would be cheaper. California spends roughly around 4-5 billion on state services for illegals.


OK.......but since that huge force only sparsely covers the southern border, by your own figures,......why wouldn't illegals just go around it?
You can't use the military for police work due to [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act]Posse Comitatus Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]


Think we are getting a bit ludicrous here??

BTW...Do these border guards ever sleep or eat? (did you figure 8 hr shifts for them?....If not...multiply your new force by three & your $800,000,000 becomes $2,400,000,000)
 
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OK.......but since that huge force only sparsely covers the southern border, by your own figures,......why wouldn't illegals just go around it?

snip..

BTW...Do these border guards ever sleep or eat? (did you figure 8 hr shifts for them?)

Then add more border guards.


You can't use the military for police work due to Posse Comitatus Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is going on in many states.

ICE begins immigration cross-training for Arkansas Law Enforcement Officers
 

Which should have been done along time ago. Here in Missouri where I live the police will tell you they have been told to leave illegal immigrants alone unless they have broken a law.

When Obama made the statement that we could not deport 12 million people he was false. Sure it might not be smart to go on round ups and try to get them all at once but to deport them as we find them would be very doable.

A friend of mine came here last year from the UK. He over stayed his visa and was later detained and deported. I thought it strange how they will deport one person from the UK in MI but here they wont touch large groups of illegal hispanics.
 
Then add more border guards.

How many?

Do me a favor & write to your elected reps with the specifics of your ideas on sealing the borders ...I'd love to see it.

(& then compare the costs to President's HC plan.)
 
ICE is a relatively small force who already have police powers.You'd still need MILLIONS more personnel to make a dent.

If we allow local law enforcment to detain them and deport them we wouldnt have to have a new force for task. If we stopped the war on drugs we would have a lot of resources at our disposal. ;)
 
If we allow local law enforcment to detain them and deport them we wouldnt have to have a new force for task.
What do we do with these same people TOMORROW when they try to get back in?...Then the next day....& then the next??? If you don't shoot them, they will be back. Do we shoot them?
If we stopped the war on drugs we would have a lot of resources at our disposal. ;)

As an ex DEA Agent, I do agree with that idea. Legalize & tax all drugs, but that's for another thread..
 
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Which should have been done along time ago. Here in Missouri where I live the police will tell you they have been told to leave illegal immigrants alone unless they have broken a law.


Illegal immigration itself is a crime punishable up to six months in jail for the first offense.

When Obama made the statement that we could not deport 12 million people he was false. Sure it might not be smart to go on round ups and try to get them all at once but to deport them as we find them would be very doable
.
Denying state services to illegals,cracking down on employers and anything to drive illegals out of the country would probably be much easier, checking the immigration status of anyone arrest would probably discourage a lot of people from staying here illegally.
 
Illegal immigration itself is a crime punishable up to six months in jail for the first offense.

.
Denying state services to illegals,cracking down on employers and anything to drive illegals out of the country would probably be much easier, checking the immigration status of anyone arrest would probably discourage a lot of people from staying here illegally.

You'll be sure to send me a copy of the below requested letter as soon as you send it off.....Won't you?

Do me a favor & write to your elected reps with the specifics of your ideas on sealing the borders ...I'd love to see it.
 
What do we do with these same people TOMORROW when they try to get back in? If you don't shoot them, they will be back. Do we shoot them?

It is alot more complex then just deportation. We need to fix many aspects of the situation. Leaving them here sure isnt going to help deter others.

While I am very anti illegal immigrant I also understand that we need to make the process of becoming a legal immigrant much easier. Thats not saying we should allow all those that want to immigrant here a pass but the current process only makes illegal entry more appealing.
 
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