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Fines for abortion?

Do you feel the government should be allowed to do this?

  • Total voters
    21
Zyphlin

Zyphlin

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So here's the question. Do you feel the government has the power, or should, fine a woman for either having an abortion or choosing not to carry a child to term? Essentially, that women are completely free to do with their body as they wish, and their privacy is definitely respected.........but if you chose to not carry to term / to abort then the government fines you X amount of dollars, say to cover the costs of people who may be getting free abortions due to lack of financial means or to cover the loss of revenue the government will feel by not having an extra citizen come into this world.

Would this be a breach of the right to privacy? Should the government be fining you for choosing not to do something that you believe effects your health?
 
Zyphlin said:
So here's the question. Do you feel the government has the power, or should, fine a woman for either having an abortion or choosing not to carry a child to term? Essentially, that women are completely free to do with their body as they wish, and their privacy is definitely respected.........but if you chose to not carry to term / to abort then the government fines you X amount of dollars, say to cover the costs of people who may be getting free abortions due to lack of financial means or to cover the loss of revenue the government will feel by not having an extra citizen come into this world.

Would this be a breach of the right to privacy? Should the government be fining you for choosing not to do something that you believe effects your health?
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Well done.
:applaud
 
Should there be a fine for masturbation then for males?
 
In order to fine a woman for getting an abortion, you would have to demonstrably show how her actions in getting an abortion financially impacts others.

Otherwise, the premise of the poll is pretty stupid.
 
PeteEU said:
Should there be a fine for masturbation then for males?
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No. But I don't really think there should be one on abortion.

There, I answered your question. Now how about you actually answer mine and talk of the topic. Do you believe the government should/does have the power to be able levy such kind of fines, and if not why not?
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
In order to fine a woman for getting an abortion, you would have to demonstrably show how her actions in getting an abortion financially impacts others.

Otherwise, the premise of the poll is pretty stupid.
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So someone should not be fined by the government unless they themselves are somehow contributing to some sort of financial impact on another in a tangiable way?
 
Zyphlin said:
So someone should not be fined by the government unless they themselves are somehow contributing to some sort of financial impact on another in a tangiable way?
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This is leading to..."well if you think THAT then how can you defend THIS liberal policy!"

itsatrap.jpg
 
new coup for you said:
This is leading to..."well if you think THAT then how can you defend THIS liberal policy!"
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Actually, I had no intention of bringing that up in any way in this thread. Far more me trying to understand the rationale of people because I routinely am seeing a thought process that is conflicting so maybe it'll give me some insight.

When doing threads like these I don't like actually springing any "trap", though have at times in the past. To me its cheap. That doesn't mean I won't start another thread discussing the issue and using insight from this one, but often times people try to much to spring "the trap" that it ruins a legitimately good conversation.

And its not just support x, but also oppose x.
 
Zyphlin said:
So someone should not be fined by the government unless they themselves are somehow contributing to some sort of financial impact on another in a tangiable way?
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Of course. For example, if I change the oil in my car and just dump it out in my yard, I could face some fairly stiff fines due to my potentially poisoning streams and groundwater.

If I am on a backpacking trip and go into the wilderness woefully unprepared, and thus find myself in need of emergency assistance, in many states I can be fined for the costs of back country emergency assistance and the lives risked in helping me.

Similarly, it could just as reasonable to argue that if you show up at a hospital needing life saving treatment, are uninsured, yet have the financial to have been able to purchase insurance, then it could perfectly reasonable to impose a fine because your personal choices impacted others financially.
 
Zyphlin said:
No. But I don't really think there should be one on abortion.

There, I answered your question. Now how about you actually answer mine and talk of the topic. Do you believe the government should/does have the power to be able levy such kind of fines, and if not why not?
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No, because I dont believe the government should meddle in such things.
 
Zyphlin said:
So here's the question. Do you feel the government has the power, or should, fine a woman for either having an abortion or choosing not to carry a child to term? Essentially, that women are completely free to do with their body as they wish, and their privacy is definitely respected.........but if you chose to not carry to term / to abort then the government fines you X amount of dollars, say to cover the costs of people who may be getting free abortions due to lack of financial means or to cover the loss of revenue the government will feel by not having an extra citizen come into this world.

Would this be a breach of the right to privacy? Should the government be fining you for choosing not to do something that you believe effects your health?
Click to expand...

No. The government should not be in the business of making medical decisions for a person.
 
jallman said:
No. The government should not be in the business of making medical decisions for a person.
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That aint what he is talking about. Giving a fine is not "making medical decisions" for anyone.. it is giving a fine for doing something supposedly "wrong".. it is behaviour modification nothing more, nothing less.
 
PeteEU said:
That aint what he is talking about. Giving a fine is not "making medical decisions" for anyone.. it is giving a fine for doing something supposedly "wrong".. it is behaviour modification nothing more, nothing less.
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WRONG. The whole purpose of fines and punative actions is to discourage or encourage specific decisions to be made. It's making a decision for you.

My point stands: I don't think the government should be in the business of making medical decisions for anyone.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Similarly, it could just as reasonable to argue that if you show up at a hospital needing life saving treatment, are uninsured, yet have the financial to have been able to purchase insurance, then it could perfectly reasonable to impose a fine because your personal choices impacted others financially.
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No it's not. It's reasonable to fine someone for not paying a debt and financially impacting other then but to preemptively fine someone for having a medical emergency without insurance because you assume they won't pay the debt to the hospital is a bit outlandish.
 
Population controls hinder growth as well as deprive our country of potential human brain power. If the majority of the fetus's that were aborted, were not, we would be a better off country for it, both morally and economically. IMHO of course.

Of course, there are the rape/incest issues that should provide the cause to abort, as well as if the child has a low % chance to live, but the birth will kill the mother.

BTW i cannot vote because im on a stupid ****ing sun microsystems pc:(
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Population controls hinder growth as well as deprive our country of potential human brain power. If the majority of the fetus's that were aborted, were not, we would be a better off country for it, both morally and economically. IMHO of course.

Of course, there are the rape/incest issues that should provide the cause to abort, as well as if the child has a low % chance to live, but the birth will kill the mother.

BTW i cannot vote because im on a stupid ****ing sun microsystems pc:(
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Over population can also be a hinderance to ecenomic growth. Look at China or the b aby boomers busting medicare.
 
Zyphlin said:
So here's the question. Do you feel the government has the power, or should, fine a woman for either having an abortion or choosing not to carry a child to term? Essentially, that women are completely free to do with their body as they wish, and their privacy is definitely respected.........but if you chose to not carry to term / to abort then the government fines you X amount of dollars, say to cover the costs of people who may be getting free abortions due to lack of financial means or to cover the loss of revenue the government will feel by not having an extra citizen come into this world.

Would this be a breach of the right to privacy? Should the government be fining you for choosing not to do something that you believe effects your health?
Click to expand...

Fining someone for acessing a medical procedure is wrong. Additionally, it would be illogical as a live birth actually results in far more of a cost to the government than an abortion would. When one factors in schooling, health insuranc for children, pre- and post natal care, health visitor appointments, nursery fees, school fees, the cost of exmanitions, the cost of the associated benefits due to those with children (Child Benefit, Child Tax Credits, Working Family Tax Credit) one can see that if anyone is costing the government money, rightly or wrongly, it's parent's, not women who abort.
 
Goldenboy219 said:
Population controls hinder growth as well as deprive our country of potential human brain power. If the majority of the fetus's that were aborted, were not, we would be a better off country for it, both morally and economically. IMHO of course.

Of course, there are the rape/incest issues that should provide the cause to abort, as well as if the child has a low % chance to live, but the birth will kill the mother.

BTW i cannot vote because im on a stupid ****ing sun microsystems pc:(
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Really? Because I contend that if not for abortion being available, we would probably have a much bigger welfare problem on our hands, higher crime rates, much more common instances of child abuse and neglect, more widespread addiction problems, and a swelling population of broken, damaged undesirables to support.
 
winston53660 said:
Over population can also be a hinderance to ecenomic growth. Look at China or the b aby boomers busting medicare.
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China's economy is growing at a rate that we can only dream of. Eventually, they will be the worlds largest economy. Once they develop a sustainable middle class, there will be no way to catch up either.

Unless of course we have more babies or open the immigration flood gates.
 
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PeteEU said:
That aint what he is talking about. Giving a fine is not "making medical decisions" for anyone.. it is giving a fine for doing something supposedly "wrong".. it is behaviour modification nothing more, nothing less.
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Basically, it's on a par with investigating the personal life of someone presenting at an Emerengency Room with a heart attack, to see if they've ever smoked or eaten unhealthy foods or drank or sat on the couch when they could have been exercising, so as to fine them accordingly based on these acts. It'd be unfair and a deeply selective penalty, as, if one looked hrd enough, we could find something a person had done to make themselves more likely to need any treatment or procedure.
 
jallman said:
Really? Because I contend that if not for abortion being available, we would probably have a much bigger welfare problem on our hands, higher crime rates, much more common instances of child abuse and neglect, more widespread addiction problems, and a swelling population of broken, damaged undesirables to support.
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That could all be true, although it is arbitrary at best. What we do know though, is that the only way to stimulate economic growth during stagnate periods is with population expansion.

But, your response would be typical to the opinion of many American citizens when the massive waves of immigrants were coming ashore in the late 19th early 20th century. You know, the tired, poor, and sick;)
 
Goldenboy219 said:
China's economy is growing at a rate that we can only dream of. Eventually, they will be the worlds largest economy. Once they develop a sustainable middle class, there will be no way to catch up either.

Unless of course we have more babies.
Click to expand...

And China does have very strict population controls.
 
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