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Thread: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

  1. #61
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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coronado View Post
    I know, I know, it's all a conspiracy to sap and impurify our precious bodily fluids.
    If you dont want to have a debate about it, no need to act like a child. Just tell me you dont want to discuss this further with me, and that would be that.


    THE GREATEST FREEDOM IS THE FREEDOM TO OPPRESS OTHERS

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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    The U.S. does not view Taiwan as a soverign nation. We are completely observant of the One China policy and have been since the Nixon administration.

    Jue | The "One China" Policy: Terms of Art



    As you can see, we grant no such recognition to Taiwan.
    Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coronado View Post
    Taiwan not being a country isn't related to this discussion? That's an interesting take.

    Thanks to tlmorg02 for setting you straight.
    All you are doing is using that as evidence when you can't dispute the ramifications of a more aggressive stance by China if they decide to invade Taiwan.

    You could of actually commented about my whole post instead of one word I used, but thats fine. It makes my job posting easier.


    China is already an authoritarian state that has strongly growing power, it isn't in the interest of the world to allow them to annex people that are not currently in their influence. As I said before, the idea of a "country" is a separate issue from the facts about those people.

  3. #63
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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by OxymoronP View Post
    They are doing pretty well for themselves, and their military potential is immense especially on the open tank friendly Europe. If we stick our head into the sand Russia will expand into Europe and China into asia. We will be isolated and at great risk of annhilation.

    The right understands that the main point of the goverment is to protect the citizens from outside powers. thus the military should be the paramount concern of the goverment.
    Russia Defense Budget Fiscal 2009: $50 Billion

    United States Defense Budget Fiscal 2009: $514 Billion (Does not include spending for wars in Iraq or Afghanistan)

    United States Defense Spending Fiscal 2009 with supplementals: $651 Billion (Still does not include spending for wars in Iraq or Afghanistan).

    Once you add in both wars, and off budget items such as Veterans Affairs our total defense expenditures for 2009 are around 1 Trillion dollars which is about 20 times what Russia will spend. Russia would have to devote nearly 50% of its GDP to defense spending to keep up with us.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Russia Defense Budget Fiscal 2009: $50 Billion

    United States Defense Budget Fiscal 2009: $514 Billion (Does not include spending for wars in Iraq or Afghanistan)

    United States Defense Spending Fiscal 2009 with supplementals: $651 Billion (Still does not include spending for wars in Iraq or Afghanistan).

    Once you add in both wars, and off budget items such as Veterans Affairs our total defense expenditures for 2009 are around 1 Trillion dollars which is about 20 times what Russia will spend. Russia would have to devote nearly 50% of its GDP to defense spending to keep up with us.
    You forget that a dollar spent in Russia goes a heck of alot further then in the US. In anycase I didnt say they are catching up to us, but there is no reason to make ourselves weaker internationally just because Russia and CHina arent there yet.


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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Russia Defense Budget Fiscal 2009: $50 Billion

    United States Defense Budget Fiscal 2009: $514 Billion (Does not include spending for wars in Iraq or Afghanistan)

    United States Defense Spending Fiscal 2009 with supplementals: $651 Billion (Still does not include spending for wars in Iraq or Afghanistan).

    Once you add in both wars, and off budget items such as Veterans Affairs our total defense expenditures for 2009 are around 1 Trillion dollars which is about 20 times what Russia will spend. Russia would have to devote nearly 50% of its GDP to defense spending to keep up with us.
    For the present you are right. Even though I doubt a Sino-Russia alliance because of their history, those nations together may have simillar military spending together once their economies grow more.

    We still should work to gain alliances with more nations, that will not get us into wars, for the long term though.

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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by OxymoronP View Post
    You forget that a dollar spent in Russia goes a heck of alot further then in the US. In anycase I didnt say they are catching up to us, but there is no reason to make ourselves weaker internationally just because Russia and CHina arent there yet.
    The numbers accounted for purchasing power parity. China's defense budget is around 70 billion. Neither nation can even remotely compete with us and at the rate they are going, it would take them decades to be able to.

    The more we trade with each other and the more our economies depend upon each other, this is especially true with China, the safer we all are. China needs us more than we need them, it would be devastating to their economy to enter into a military conflict with us.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    You could of [sic] actually commented about my whole post instead of one word I used, but thats fine. It makes my job posting easier.
    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    China is already an authoritarian state that has strongly growing power, it isn't in the interest of the world to allow them to annex people that are not currently in their influence. As I said before, the idea of a "country" is a separate issue from the facts about those people.
    "Strongly growing power" is not a term that should be used to describe the PRC in any aspect other than economics. They can barely keep a lid on Xinjiang. As noted above, the mainland and Taiwan are more and more closely aligned economically with every passing day. Only ignorant General Jack D. Ripper types who are locked in the 1950's are afraid of a military action against either Taiwan or the US. This is 2009, and those Cold War paradigms no longer apply.
    Last edited by Coronado; 09-01-09 at 03:51 PM.

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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by OxymoronP View Post
    You forget that a dollar spent in Russia goes a heck of alot further then in the US. In anycase I didnt say they are catching up to us, but there is no reason to make ourselves weaker internationally just because Russia and CHina arent there yet.
    In defense of my friend Oxymoron, and to set the record straight, Russia and China are already in an alliance in regards to their continental security from what they percieve as a threat from the U.S. This alliance is called the Shanghai Corporation Organization.

    The Shanghai Cooperation Organization - Council on Foreign Relations

    The Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO)--composed of China, Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan--was formed as a confidence-building mechanism to resolve border disputes. It has risen in stature since then, making headlines in 2005 when it called for Washington to set a timeline for withdrawing from military bases in Central Asia. Over the past few years, the organization's activities have expanded to include increased military cooperation, intelligence sharing, and counterterrorism drills.
    I will let this speak for itself. To pretend these nations are no threat, is to go to the other extreme from saying they are a dire one.

  9. #69
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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    The numbers accounted for purchasing power parity. China's defense budget is around 70 billion. Neither nation can even remotely compete with us and at the rate they are going, it would take them decades to be able to.
    This, of course, assumes they even WANT to. China holds trillions of dollars and they have a budget surplus (it's pretty damn funny that we need to take fiscal responsibilty lessons from Communists, but that's another thread). They could easily pour more into defense. But they don't. Because it's not their aim nor their goal to start WWIII. Which is why right wing paranoia is so freakin' hilarious. We don't need to do more to protect ourselves from a threat that doesn't even exist. Same with Russia. They aren't a threat and have no plans to become one. No one is attacking us.
    Wow. Am I awesome or what?

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    Re: Is the Republic of China (Taiwan) worth protecting?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    The numbers accounted for purchasing power parity. China's defense budget is around 70 billion. Neither nation can even remotely compete with us and at the rate they are going, it would take them decades to be able to.

    The more we trade with each other and the more our economies depend upon each other, this is especially true with China, the safer we all are. China needs us more than we need them, it would be devastating to their economy to enter into a military conflict with us.
    Do not become over confident on this my friend. China is making strides to create a domestic consumer base, as well as they are strengthening trade relations with the other members of ASEAN and ASEAN plus 3. Only this week China signed a $50 billion oil or natural gas agreement with Australia. Before long, they may indeed not be all that reliant on us.

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