View Poll Results: Should healthcare insurance be mandatory for everyone?

Voters
50. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes. Explain please.

    14 28.00%
  • No. Explain please.

    36 72.00%
Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 112

Thread: Healthcare mandatory?

  1. #31
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    Are you saying you support
    -Government-run food industry
    -Government-run housing
    -Government-run everything else necessary for survival
    ?
    We already have those things to some extent. I, for one, fully support food stamps. I would much rather have a program like the food stamp program instead of a program that just gives people money.

    The same is true of government-run housing. While I do support some housing assistance for those who can't afford it, I do not support government-owned "projects," since they breed crime and are usually filthy. I would much rather have the government give people a voucher to find their own housing.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  2. #32
    Sage
    Dav's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    04-16-16 @ 02:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    5,539

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I would much rather have a program like the food stamp program instead of a program that just gives people money.
    Why? I mean, if you just gave them money, it would be their money to use any way they wanted, and chances are they might want to buy food with it....

  3. #33
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dav View Post
    Why? I mean, if you just gave them money, it would be their money to use any way they wanted, and chances are they might want to buy food with it....
    They might. Or they might want to buy heroin with it.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  4. #34
    Sage
    Dav's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    04-16-16 @ 02:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    5,539

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    They might. Or they might want to buy heroin with it.
    Hmm... good point.

  5. #35
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,880
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Let me clarify. Both potential outcomes are bad. But I don't see why on Earth we should expect the taxpayers and hospitals to cover the entire bill.
    I would rather expect the tax payer and the hospital pay for the entire bill than to put people in jail just for living.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Doesn't it seem at least more responsible for those who are getting healthcare to pay at least SOMETHING?
    Of course. But I'm not arguing that. While I certainly believe in personal responsibility I do not think that a person should get taxed, fined or go to jail for simply living.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    If we are going to have to pay for it, let's at least make the person getting care pay for part of it. It's only fair that way.
    Fine, I can easily agree with that. But that does not mean that insurance has to be mandatory. It can be done on a case by case basis.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    There is a potential solution here though. After getting care, your wages are garnished or some of your property seized to cover the costs if you do not pay up.
    Which is pretty much what happens now.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    But what do we do for truly destitute people? Let them just die?
    I wouldn't mind paying for their healthcare via taxes. As is done now. But again destitute people either don't care if they get health care or not or will readily sign up for Obamacare the second they get the chance.

    If it's the first one then they won't care if they get insurance or not. More than likely because jail would be a better alternative than what they have now. (3 square meals a day, a bed to sleep in etc etc) So no need for mandatory here as it will just cost the taxpayer even more money than trying to make them have insurance.

    If it's the second one then there is no need to make it mandatory. For obvious reasons.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  6. #36
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    So your solution is to force hospitals to treat people for emergency care, and then stick them with the bill if the person is unable to pay for whatever reason. Got it.
    It is very unlikely that they won't be able to pay in the future.
    A payment plan should be arranged and if the person tries to stiff them they can take them to court and have their wages garnished.

    Why should someone be allowed to be a deadbeat when the hospital could have potentially saved their life?

    If they die the hospital can go after the estate of the person.
    If there is nothing in the estate to take then they can suck it up like the rest of creditors have to do when someone dies penniless.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  7. #37
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    It is very unlikely that they won't be able to pay in the future.
    A payment plan should be arranged and if the person tries to stiff them they can take them to court and have their wages garnished.
    What if the nature of the condition for which they are being treated makes them unable to return to work?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla
    If they die the hospital can go after the estate of the person.
    If there is nothing in the estate to take then they can suck it up like the rest of creditors have to do when someone dies penniless.
    Except unlike other creditors, the patient was brought to the hospital and the hospital had no choice but to treat them. Or if you are implausibly suggesting that hospitals be allowed to dig through ER patients' pockets for insurance cards and refuse treatment if they don't find one, they are still at a disadvantage over, say, a bank, in that they don't have much time to analyze the patient's financial data before deciding whether or not to treat them.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 08-31-09 at 01:36 AM.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  8. #38
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    What if the nature of the condition for which they are being treated makes them unable to return to work?
    They can go on disability like everyone else and I suppose the taxpayer can foot it, since they will anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Except unlike other creditors, the patient was brought to the hospital and the hospital had no choice but to treat them. Or if you are implausibly suggesting that hospitals be allowed to dig through ER patients' pockets for insurance cards and refuse treatment if they don't find one, they are still at a disadvantage over, say, a bank, in that they don't have much time to analyze the patient's financial data before deciding whether or not to treat them.
    Not even close.

    The hospital can collect all that information after the patient is stabilized just like now.
    They don't need to be a bank they just need to be paid and making medical expenses not included in bankruptcy solves this.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  9. #39
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    They can go on disability like everyone else and I suppose the taxpayer can foot it, since they will anyway.
    Or we can just require them to have insurance so that the taxpayer doesn't NEED to foot it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla
    Not even close.

    The hospital can collect all that information after the patient is stabilized just like now.
    Irrelevant. By that time, they've already incurred the expense of treating the patient. If they collect that information and find out he's a bad credit risk, they can't go back and un-treat him.

    They shouldn't have to "suck it up like the rest of the creditors." Unlike all the other creditors, the hospital didn't have a choice but to provide the service, and they didn't have the patient's financial information when they did.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla
    They don't need to be a bank they just need to be paid and making medical expenses not included in bankruptcy solves this.
    So an 18-year-old who is in a serious car accident and runs up $2 million in medical bills should be saddled with that debt for the rest of his life? That sounds like a remarkably strong incentive for people to become prostitutes and drug-dealers instead of doctors and businessmen.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  10. #40
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Healthcare mandatory?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Or we can just require them to have insurance so that the taxpayer doesn't NEED to foot it.
    I don't believe in pre-coercion, now post coercion after you have incurred a debt, I'm all for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Irrelevant. By that time, they've already incurred the expense of treating the patient. If they collect that information and find out he's a bad credit risk, they can't go back and un-treat him.

    They shouldn't have to "suck it up like the rest of the creditors." Unlike all the other creditors, the hospital didn't have a choice but to provide the service, and they didn't have the patient's financial information when they did.
    So what, in this hypothetical situation they have the legal means to collect their money that is owed to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    So an 18-year-old who is in a serious car accident and runs up $2 million in medical bills should be saddled with that debt for the rest of his life? That sounds like a remarkably strong incentive for people to become prostitutes and drug-dealers instead of doctors and businessmen.
    Insurance wouldn't have to be mandatory after a couple of those I guarantee it.
    It's called cause and effect, you take a great risk you may not like the outcome.
    Of course that doesn't mean that a charity won't help.
    Last edited by Harry Guerrilla; 08-31-09 at 02:12 AM.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •