View Poll Results: Where do you stand on UHC?

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  • I'm pro-choice and I support UHC

    22 46.81%
  • I'm pro-choice and I do not support UHC

    9 19.15%
  • I'm pro-life and I support UHC

    2 4.26%
  • I'm pro-life and I do not support UHC

    11 23.40%
  • Other (explain)

    3 6.38%
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Thread: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

  1. #71
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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    the Big O is smart enough to know he can not get everything he wants ............now
    so he is going to implement it inch by inch during his administration
    if he gets what he wants now, my prediction is that he will find something more that 'will require' more expansion into healthcare until dear leaders single payer system is complete

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    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeJayH View Post
    the Big O is smart enough to know he can not get everything he wants ............now
    so he is going to implement it inch by inch during his administration
    if he gets what he wants now, my prediction is that he will find something more that 'will require' more expansion into healthcare until dear leaders single payer system is complete
    Inch by inch is how any significant changes to health care should be implemented. While I understand why Obama wants to rush it, I don't think it is wise. Make some (hopeful) improvements, take some time, analyze the result, make some more changes. Of course, there are practical problems with this approach, but it's how I think it should be done.

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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Inch by inch is how any significant changes to health care should be implemented. While I understand why Obama wants to rush it, I don't think it is wise. Make some (hopeful) improvements, take some time, analyze the result, make some more changes. Of course, there are practical problems with this approach, but it's how I think it should be done.
    I concur 100%. They could fix MassHC, and show us how it can be done right, and than

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    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Any low-premium / high-deductible public option would do the same thing.
    "Public" = UHC here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    There aren't any in the current UHC proposals either. Take off your tinfoil hat.
    Section 1233 of H.R. 3200 Advance Care Planning Consultation

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Nope, under your plan those costs would just be passed off to the taxpayer.
    "My" plan? I'm a politician who has presented a bill? When the **** did this happen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Those things don't exist in any of the current UHC proposals either. Take off your tinfoil hat.
    "Shared responsibility payments" FTW

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    So would your plan.
    ....*sniker*....MY plan....yeah I made, run and personally own Medicaid

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The only difference is that your plan would pretend that they aren't covered until they actually need to be covered.
    Right, exactly. They aren't covered unless they need to be. It's great.

    Obama would require that everyone be covered, for everything, rather they need it or not so that they have to pay for it. Fines to employers who do not offer insurance, fines to individuals of about $1,000 for declining coverage, and more for families who aren't covered.

    It sounds like you would for the most part agree with me, that Obama care is a bad idea as proposed, if you accepted various facts regarding fines and mandated coverage.

    Let's work on some compromise here. You're hell bent on UHC, and Obama won the election so it IS going to happen in some form.

    Let's take Norway for example. They have UHC, and it works for them. Why not here?

    The reason it won't work here is because Norway can afford socialism. They pay for it with cash, because they allow off-shore oil drilling and impose competitive terrifs for foreign entities to drill in arias of their control.

    The US does not.

    So, you want UHC, ok. You can have it if you can pay for it, and taxing the rich has proven not to be the way. The government has to get a job and produce something.

    Taking Norway as the example, the US needs to drill ANWAR and the Gulf Coast, and authorization for this drilling needs to be established before we even think of discussing the specifics of UHC.
    Last edited by Jerry; 08-29-09 at 04:05 PM.

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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    "Public" = UHC here?


    Section 1233 of H.R. 3200 Advance Care Planning Consultation



    "My" plan? I'm a politician who has presented a bill? When the **** did this happen?



    "Shared responsibility payments" FTW



    ....*sniker*....MY plan....yeah I made, run and personally own Medicaid



    Right, exactly. They aren't covered unless they need to be. It's great.

    Obama would require that everyone be covered, for everything, rather they need it or not so that they have to pay for it.
    The whole purpose of insurance is to share the risk. That means you pay your premiums when you don't need it, you pay your premiums when you do need it, and the insurance pays your bills when you need it.

    That whole concept is lost if you start allowing anyone and everyone to jump on board Medicaid whenever they need it without asking them to directly contribute anything when they don't. UHC would be a big improvement over what you are suggesting, because the funding will mostly be derived from customers who pay premiums, instead of from the taxpayers as a whole.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 08-29-09 at 04:07 PM.
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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The whole purpose of insurance is to share the risk. That means you pay your premiums when you don't need it, you pay your premiums when you do need it, and the insurance pays your bills when you need it.

    That whole concept is lost if you start allowing anyone and everyone to jump on board Medicaid whenever they need it without asking them to directly contribute anything when they don't. UHC would be a big improvement over what you are suggesting, because the funding will mostly be derived from customers who pay premiums, instead of from the taxpayers as a whole.
    I edited.


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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry
    So, you want UHC, ok. You can have it if you can pay for it, and taxing the rich has proven not to be the way. The government has to get a job and produce something.
    Let me ask you this: Would you be opposed to a public option - open to all citizens and legal residents - that charged a high enough premium to cover its expenses, offered two free checkups per year (and maybe other preventative stuff like mammograms), had a deductible of $1500-3000 per year, and covered 100% of expenses beyond that? This sort of plan seems ideal to me. It controls costs by making doctors compete with each other on price, it's easy to understand, it encourages prevention, it's revenue-neutral, and it covers everyone who wants it.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 08-29-09 at 04:08 PM.
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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Let me ask you this: Would you be opposed to a public option - open to all citizens and legal residents - that charged a high enough premium to cover its expenses, offered two free checkups per year (and maybe other preventative stuff like mammograms), had a deductible of $1500-3000 per year, and covered 100% of expenses beyond that?

    This sort of plan seems ideal to me. It controls costs, it's simple, it encourages prevention, it's revenue-neutral, and it covers everyone who wants it..
    That is NOT what Obama is proposing.

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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    That is NOT what Obama is proposing.
    That's not what I asked.
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    Re: Pro-choice and Pro-UHC

    Look I'll compromise on all kinds of things. You want gay-marriage? Fine. Make divorce harder to get in the same bill and I'll picket with you.

    You want abortion? Fine. Mandate parental consent for minors unless parental rights are revoked and I'll support it.

    Sex-ed in the school? Sure, right after gun-safety.

    Want UHC? Great. Allow drilling in ANWAR, Gulf Coast, and increase the terrifs for foreign entities to pay for it, then show me the dotted line.
    Last edited by Jerry; 08-29-09 at 04:16 PM.

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