View Poll Results: Are ANY government regulations of the 2nd Amendment acceptable?

Voters
95. You may not vote on this poll
  • No. It's a Constitutional Right & no regulatioins are acceptable.

    39 41.05%
  • Yes. Reasonable regulations are acceptable.

    45 47.37%
  • A law abiding citizen should have the right to own & carry full auto weapons.

    22 23.16%
  • A law abiding citizen should have the right to own & carry flame throwers.

    11 11.58%
  • A law abiding citizen should have the right to own & carry tactical nukes.

    1 1.05%
  • gun restrictions are necessary to prevent unauthorized use by nuts.

    16 16.84%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

  1. #311
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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    One last quick point for now:

    By the poll results so far, it would seem that more people buy the "Reasonable regulations are acceptable." argument than the one I'm hearing right now.
    An appeal to authority is nothing but a fallacy argument.

    The fact is reasonable is subjective. So it proves little. I mean even I think some reasonable laws are OK. I think yours are unreasonable.
    Last edited by Black Dog; 08-25-09 at 02:07 PM.
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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    One last quick point for now:

    By the poll results so far, it would seem that more people buy the "Reasonable regulations are acceptable." argument than the one I'm hearing right now.

    I'll be back
    Everyone has a different definition of what reasonable regulations means.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    There should be only one absolute requirement for owning a fire arm, and that is completion of an appropriate fire arm safety course.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    There should be only one absolute requirement for owning a fire arm, and that is completion of an appropriate fire arm safety course.
    I don't even like that because you can then make it so the class is once a year at some horrible time people can't make or that it costs exorbitant amounts of money, thus creating an effective backdoor ban on firearms.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I don't even like that because you can then make it so the class is once a year at some horrible time people can't make or that it costs exorbitant amounts of money, thus creating an effective backdoor ban on firearms.
    Oh come on, I think that really is just common sense. No one is born with proper training. All our soldiers get that training.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Oh come on, I think that really is just common sense. No one is born with proper training. All our soldiers get that training.
    No one is born with proper training, but it's up to them to get it. Making them complete tasks given by the government to exercise a right opens up way too many channels for abuse and oppressions.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    There should be only one absolute requirement for owning a fire arm, and that is completion of an appropriate fire arm safety course.
    I'll support that as long as the appropriate firearm safety course is mandatory in the Senior year of high school.

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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    They tried REAL HARD & severely wounded many including cops who they outgunned at the time.
    Newsflash: Sometimes cops get shot at.

    What a silly argument....Are you saying these guys didn't present a lethal danger to the city for quite a while?
    I wasn't making an argument. Just stating a fact. Those two didn't kill ANYONE. Why? Because they didn't know how to employ their weapon systems properly.

    Ever had a gun pointed at you?
    I've been in a fire fight. Not sure if anyone aimed specifically at me but I know what it's like.

  9. #319
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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    The fallacies have flown so thick and so fast I don't know if I can keep up with them all.


    Comparing cars and guns is fallacious. Cars are not a right guaranteed in the Constitution for one thing. For another, if you lack a car when you need one, the consequence is that travel is more difficult. If you lack a firearm when you need one for self-protection, the consequence may be death, or worse.

    Body armor is a defense. Regulating a defensive item that is itself incapable of inflicting harm is nonsensical. So criminals might use them to confound the police? Deal with it...put a .308 in every other patrol car. Criminals use cars too, sometimes to run down officers...haven't heard of anyone calling for an automobile ban. As for when a civilian would need one...when something goes bump in the night, I don't call 911 (they take forever), I slip on my kevlar vest, grab my AK47 and go check. Most of the time it is nothing... if it ever is something, I want all the advantages I can get. Body armor? check. AK47 with 30 round mag? check. Skillz? check.

    The military consists of about 3.5 million individuals, last time I checked. The population is about 300 million. Nukes and aircraft carriers aren't necessary to protect against a government turned tyrannical, infantry weapons will suffice. This assumes all the military would side with the gov't, which I doubt.

    Nor is "in defense of liberty against tyranny" remotely a view of the far-right fringe...it is a view of most of the people that I know, including most current or prior service LEOs.

    What constitutes "reasonable regulations" will vary greatly depending on the individual. To me, NICS is borderline reasonable. A shall-issue permit for anything heavier than a select-fire M4 is maybe reasonable. A shall-issue permit for concealed carry (meaning they MUST issue you a permit if you have a clean background and pass a fairly simple course) is dubious, to be honest I consider it somewhat of an infringement but I accept it as a necessary step towards no-license-needed open-or-concealed carry. Most anything else I consider unreasonable.

    As I've said elsewhere, if we kept murderers, armed robbers, rapists, 'hot' burglars and such locked up for life and never let them out after their 1st offense, and put anyone who accumulated 3 felonies away for life, and did away with plea-bargaining, we wouldn't need to worry much about felons getting guns....almost all of them would be in prison!

    We need criminal control, not gun control. When we, as a society, say "enough coddling violent criminals!" and start really putting them away and keeping them there, in short when we have real criminal control in this country, then if there's still too much violent crime (which I doubt) we'll talk about gun control.

    It ain't the object that's the problem, it's the scumbag using it.
    Last edited by Goshin; 08-25-09 at 04:10 PM.

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    Re: Should There Be Any Regulations To 2nd Amnendment Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    An appeal to authority is nothing but a fallacy argument.

    The fact is reasonable is subjective. So it proves little. I mean even I think some reasonable laws are OK. I think yours are unreasonable.


    So the bottom line is we both agree that reasonable gun control laws are "OK". Politics is the art of compromise so all we have to do is negotiate our differences & decide what gun control laws are reasonable & which one are unreasonable.

    What I totally disagree with is the minority who believe that no gun controls are ever reasonable. That is a totally unreasonable opinion, imo.

    Example:
    Background checks...For those who do not oppose checking to see if a potential gun buyer is a felon/pedophile, the question is how long is reasonable to allow government to perform a background check b4 you can buy that weapon?

    I'd say that 1 month would be to long & therefore unreasonable.
    I'd say that 1 week is reasonable

    This is the type of thing legislatures can thrash out.
    Last edited by Devil505; 08-25-09 at 05:54 PM.

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