View Poll Results: Is health care a right?

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  • Yes

    30 36.59%
  • No

    52 63.41%
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Thread: Is health care in the US a right?

  1. #11
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    It is not a right because it is not defined in the Constitution as a right.
    Whoa whoa there Mr James. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. I don't think you intended to say it that way. The Constitution doesn't define our rights. And I don't want to get into a side debate on that. It defines the powers of the federal govt. And nowhere in there does it state that the govt has a duty to insure everyones health. People are taking "promote the general welfare" way to far. Promote does not mean provide, as in "provide for the common defense".

    Take the 2nd amendment, it says that the federal govt does not have power to infringe upon the right of the people to bear arms, because the states have a right to be free and secure.

    These rights already exist. They existed before the Constitution.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  2. #12
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by faminedynasty View Post
    Interesting. So nothing that is not specifically enumerated as a right in the constitution can be a right? Health care seems relevant to the general welfare of the people, but, as you say, it is not enumerated.
    I won't question the wisdom of the founders, but maybe we could take into account that medicine didn't really exist per se during the writing of the authoring of the constitution, and it was not generally possible for the common people to live for very long to make us have to worry about care of the elderly, so enumerating it as a right at the time would be like listing teleportation as a right today. The founders in their wisdom did not address airplanes either, I cannot imagine why.
    You are aware that doctors did exist back then? Even if it didn't exist it still would not make it a right. It is not listed in the constitution therefore it is not a right. Your classist rant does not make it a right. If you want medical care to be a right then you need to put it in the Constitution.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  3. #13
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    I think in a civilized, wealthy society, there should be enough compassion and intellect to allow all the right to be able to seek medical attention. The fact that many do not see this, simply shows me how much farther humanity has to evolve. Some of you are not far removed from barbarians.

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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    I think in a civilized, wealthy society, there should be enough compassion and intellect to allow all the right to be able to seek medical attention. The fact that many do not see this, simply shows me how much farther humanity has to evolve. Some of you are not far removed from barbarians.
    Compassion is not my number one concern. I want a healthy working population.

  5. #15
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gwendoline View Post
    Health care IS a right here in Australia. Do not turn it (UHC) into the "monster". It is a humane and sensible thing to embrace.

    Ironic some of you are going to have to be forced to do the right thing.

    Why do you have to be forced to do what's right?

    Why do you have to make such a damn racket in order to embrace what is humane and correct?
    Forcing people into socialized medicine is not the correct or right thing to do.

    Shoot me down, tell me to run back to my own country, whatever, but seriously, how mean-spirited can some of you be?
    Being against socialized medicine does not make one mean spirited. Where do you get off spreading lies?

    Try opening your minds and hearts a little. Stop with the ridiculous "gun to the head" analogy. And try to see past yourselves - it will be good for your souls.
    Are you trying to argue that nothing will happen if you say that you refuse to pay taxes? What will happen in the Austrialia if you you refuse to pay taxes?


    Don't make God come down and beat you round the heads for being so untoward and ungenerous towards your fellow men / women.
    Just like the socialist to confuse generosity and charity with socialism while trying to imply that God or Jesus is a socialist. In the US tax payer money is still tax payer money not the government's money. In the US we have the belief that if someone wants something then they earn it not steal it and not get the government to steal or forcible take from others to get it for them.

    If you want your nation to be great, be benelovent, give a stuff about others, don't just go to church. Sacrifice for others! Care!
    Our nation is already great.Caving to socialist demands will not make it greater. Canada,UK,certain European countries and Australia are not better because they caved to socialist demands.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  6. #16
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Compassion is not my number one concern. I want a healthy working population.
    Common sense and the preservation of the Middle Class is my number one concern. And without this reform the costs of healthcare will be a major factor is destroying the Middle Class.

  7. #17
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Just like the socialist to confuse generosity and charity with socialism while trying to imply that God or Jesus is a socialist. In the US tax payer money is still tax payer money not the government's money. In the US we have the belief that if someone wants something then they earn it not steal it and not get the government to steal or forcible take from others to get it for them.
    I hope you felt the same way when the right-winged stacked court approved imminent domain and the socialist practice of taking people's lands so that corporations could build on them for the sake of profits.

  8. #18
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by faminedynasty View Post
    Interesting. So nothing that is not specifically enumerated as a right in the constitution can be a right? Health care seems relevant to the general welfare of the people, but, as you say, it is not enumerated.
    I won't question the wisdom of the founders, but maybe we could take into account that medicine didn't really exist per se during the writing of the authoring of the constitution, and it was not generally possible for the common people to live for very long to make us have to worry about care of the elderly, so enumerating it as a right at the time would be like listing teleportation as a right today. The founders in their wisdom did not address airplanes either, I cannot imagine why.
    Medicine did exist, the technology we have today did not.

    We already take care of the elderly and veterans so you have no point.

    Fallacy argument. No one has a right to transportation or airplanes.

    Quote Originally Posted by faminedynasty View Post
    All that tedious crap aside, It ought to be a right. A nation as powerful and obscenely rich as ours ought to invest some of its money in the preserving of life, rather than purely squandering it on more and more implements to destroy life. And healthcare ought not be merely the birthright of the wealthy, but the generous and sensible gift of a generous and sensible people to our citizens, lest we be thought of as bloodthirsty, greedy, insane monsters by the rest of the world. And history.
    And that is or seems to be part of the problem.

    We are not insanely rich. We are borrowing money from China, hello? We have companys moving oversea's like rats leaving a sinking ship with many American jobs. So that insanely rich part does not really float anymore.

    In the end all we are doing is strapping future generations with a national debt that is larger than our GDP??? How responsable is that people?

    Health care is not the birthright of the wealthy. Lets be honest here anyone can be treated at any emergency room in this country. In most states anyone can walk into the local county hospital and get treated. Lets not even go into Medicare and Medicaid. Health care for the wealthy is a lie as the majority of the population does have insurance.

    An argument should be based on fact, not emotion.
    Last edited by Black Dog; 08-19-09 at 10:48 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  9. #19
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    I think in a civilized, wealthy society, there should be enough compassion and intellect to allow all the right to be able to seek medical attention.
    We already have that. Please point out a story were even an illegal immigrant has been refused medical care? I can show you many story's that are the opposite.

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    The fact that many do not see this, simply shows me how much farther humanity has to evolve. Some of you are not far removed from barbarians.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  10. #20
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    Re: Is health care in the US a right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    We already have that. Please point out a story were even an illegal immigrant has been refused medical care? I can show you many story's that are the opposite.



    No one can be refused EMERGENCY attention. However, one can be refused heart transplants, cancer treatment....because they do not have insurance. And I assume your roll of the eyes means you have no response to that, yes?

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