View Poll Results: WWJD?

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  • Support UHC

    18 37.50%
  • Support a "for profit" insurance healthcare system

    12 25.00%
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    18 37.50%
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Thread: Healthcare question for Christians

  1. #331
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by creation View Post
    Timothy 1:10

    Government taxation is not stealing. Probably why its not mentioned in any part of the Torah or Bible as such.
    Give to Cesar what belongs to Cesar. Jesus didn't seem to care much about government in what He was talking about, except for the Kingdom of God.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  2. #332
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by creation View Post
    It addresses what you said in the most direct terms.
    Aside from the fact that it is wrong...

    I certainly do have standing to disagree, Biblical interpretation and the definition of life are that basis and are the start points of the debate on that basis, the basis is not that Christ was an apolitical phenomenon.
    The point you miss here is that your position is that "it is OK to force Christian morality on to others". After you say that, you have no way to argue against people that want to do it to you.

    Of course, this is ALL removed from the fact that Jesus would not and did not advocate that His followers force His teachings on to those not willing to accept them.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 08-18-09 at 11:42 AM.

  3. #333
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    After you say that, you have no way to argue against people that want to do it to you.
    Correction -- you have no way to argue against it non-hypocritically.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  4. #334
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Correction -- you have no way to argue against it non-hypocritically.
    That's what I meant, of course.

  5. #335
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Aside from the fact that it is wrong...


    The point you miss here is that your position is that "it is OK to force Christian morality on to others". After you say that, you have no way to argue against people that want to do it to you.

    Of course, this is ALL removed from the fact that Jesus would not and did not advocate that His followers force His teachings on to those not willing to accept them.
    Thanks but its not wrong.

    Look, everyone has a morality, some believe it to be Christian inspired. Everyone agrees to a common morality, some like me believe the codification of that morality to be Christ inspired given the Judeo-Christian history of the USA and the UK and other places.

    If you dont want morality forced on you, then you're far far too late. The law you live by defines that morality. Did you really think that the law exists only to organise people efficiently and did not come out of a moral framework?

    I have a few ways to argue against people that want to force it on to me. However, if they were to form a majority of voters I would have to accept it or leave.

  6. #336
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by creation View Post
    Thanks but its not wrong.
    Indeed, it is. Contrary to your claim, and rather than Christian morality, our laws are based on the tenet that we all have rights and that the government is there to protect those rights.

    If you dont want morality forced on you, then you're far far too late.
    I expect you to accept that response when someone forces their morality on to you. In reality, I expect youl squeal like a pig.


    Of course, this is ALL removed from the fact that Jesus would not and did not advocate that His followers force His teachings on to those not willing to accept them.

  7. #337
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by creation View Post
    Thanks but its not wrong.

    Look, everyone has a morality, some believe it to be Christian inspired. Everyone agrees to a common morality, some like me believe the codification of that morality to be Christ inspired given the Judeo-Christian history of the USA and the UK and other places.

    If you dont want morality forced on you, then you're far far too late. The law you live by defines that morality. Did you really think that the law exists only to organise people efficiently and did not come out of a moral framework?

    I have a few ways to argue against people that want to force it on to me. However, if they were to form a majority of voters I would have to accept it or leave.
    You're essentially saying that our morality should not stop at negative law, whereby we tell people what they cannot do. What you want is for our morality to go into positive, whereby you tell people what they have to do. Negative law is essential in that it protects our rights, but positive law, I'm not buying it.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  8. #338
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    You're essentially saying that our morality should not stop at negative law, whereby we tell people what they cannot do. What you want is for our morality to go into positive, whereby you tell people what they have to do. Negative law is essential in that it protects our rights, but positive law, I'm not buying it.
    What he's REALLY trying to say is that a theocracy is OK, so long as its HIS interpretation of Christianity that is forced on everyone.

  9. #339
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    You're essentially saying that our morality should not stop at negative law, whereby we tell people what they cannot do. What you want is for our morality to go into positive, whereby you tell people what they have to do. Negative law is essential in that it protects our rights, but positive law, I'm not buying it.
    Of course! Our moral framework describes not only what we mustnt do but what we must.
    The constitution, in the paying of taxes, is a positive enforcement. You may argue that this should be restricted severely but thats another point.

    Love thy neighbour is an example of positive morality. Dont want to buy that?

  10. #340
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    Re: Healthcare question for Christians

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    What he's REALLY trying to say is that a theocracy is OK, so long as its HIS interpretation of Christianity that is forced on everyone.
    Im saying its too late to have it any other way, the current laws you live under where put in place before you were born.

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