View Poll Results: role of state in education

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    5 16.67%
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    13 43.33%
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    12 40.00%
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Thread: Role of government in Education

  1. #71
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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    I was speaking english.

    I didn't make the false claim that schools today teach history.
    I have seen people claim this on various occasions.

    As I never went to public school, I was wondering...what do they actually teach, and how is it wrong?
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Same old lame liberal-extortionist arguments.

    No, we're not obligated to pay their education, nor are we obligated to pay for their welfare.

    If they want to rot in prison, we can accomodate that, but we should use that Sheriff Joe from Arizona to run them.
    Do you realize that you are part of a larger society? Do you realize that it is in you best interest that those around you - doctor, lawyer, plumber, mechanic, store managers, truck drivers, etc. - are well educated? It is to your and everyone's benefit that we are an educated society.
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  3. #73
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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I have seen people claim this on various occasions.

    As I never went to public school, I was wondering...what do they actually teach, and how is it wrong?
    well they teach you that Lincoln was a great president because he freed the slaves and preserved the union

    never mind the fact that he didn't give a sh1t about the slaves according to his own words

    also what is so noble about murdering countless people just so you can preserve your control over a territory ? i asked my teacher this repeatedly and he never gave me an answer.

    they teach that federal reserve was created to bring stability to economy and end bank runs. actually many students end up thinking that federal reserve was created in response to the great depression when in fact it was around for more than a decade when the great depression hit. basically the explanations students are given are so absurd that students end up remembering everything backwards because it just simply doesn't make sense to remember it the way they are actually taught.
    Last edited by NEUROSPORT; 07-28-09 at 11:49 PM.

  4. #74
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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Layla_Z View Post
    Do you realize that you are part of a larger society? Do you realize that it is in you best interest that those around you - doctor, lawyer, plumber, mechanic, store managers, truck drivers, etc. - are well educated? It is to your and everyone's benefit that we are an educated society.
    This is correct.

    This issue that remains, however, is to determine what the term "education" should mean in this context.

    Should it mean: "Teach our children these statements and formulas, so that they may apply them to their lives in the future"? OR.

    Should it mean: "Teach our children the tools to analyze and decipher the world around them, that they may understand it fully"?

    I would much rather the latter.

    "Critical Thinking" is a term that many like to use. I personally think that it should be taught in each and every class that a student ever takes, as it applies to everything.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Layla_Z View Post
    Do you realize that you are part of a larger society? Do you realize that it is in you best interest that those around you - doctor, lawyer, plumber, mechanic, store managers, truck drivers, etc. - are well educated? It is to your and everyone's benefit that we are an educated society.
    i'd love those around me to be knowledgeable and intelligent.

    but not "well educated"

    the word "education" to me is a curse word.

    you can learn, study or research. this implies HUNGER FOR KNOWLEDGE. but education means something else - it means FORCING YOUR VIEW ON SOMEBODY ELSE.

    knowledge should come from curiosity and experience. not from indoctrination.

  6. #76
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    Re: Role of government in Education

    From the original poll options:

    option 2:

    an average adult is either not willing or not able to provide his children with the best possible education. the government should use its massive resources to ASSIST in educating children. this assistance should come in the form of vouchers and the government should be prohibited from running any schools of its own. allowing the government to run its own schools is allowing the state to control the minds of young people and since everybody was once young to effectively control the minds of all of its subjects.
    The problem with this poll is that "the government" is not a single entity. While a lot of people would agree that the Federal Government should not be in the business of running their kids elementary school, that does not mean that they do not believe it is a legitimate function of state and local governments.

    States and communities compete against each other thus states and communities have a vested interest in having an educated workforce and top performing schools. "Mind control" has nothing at all to with that.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  7. #77
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    Re: Role of government in Education

    It's a tough call, and on par (i think) with health care. No, the gov't is under no obligation to provide for anybody's education, but it benefits the entire society to provide education. It's a similar issue to roads, perhaps. The government is under no obligation to build you the roads you drive on every day, but if they didn't do it, and maintain the system, who would? Maybe private roadways would work, but we don't really have enough info to know for sure. Certainly there'd be pockets of roadways that were total ****.

    Anyway, perhaps education is one of those services that are not best handled by the gov't, but there's no better entity to do the job adequately. I can't think of a better solution.

    As a caveat to all that, i am in favor of testing certain societal ideals. Perhaps a few counties in a state would volunteer trying out complete privatization of education? It'd have to be a fairly large and representative sample size, and it'd not be perfect, but perhaps it would be a first step? Certainly we'd learn something or other.

    In closing, education is a huge issue and it always will be a huge issue. That's part of its nature and existence. Since this is the case, we ought to be studying it carefully and experimenting with various methods and trials. Of course much depends on the various educators themselves and people can't be replicated like methods can. That's one insurmountable "x-factor" that's problematic. A good teacher using a bad method in a bad system can make **** happen. A bad teacher using an excellent method in the best possible system can still **** kids up into the next decade or longer.

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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I have seen people claim this on various occasions.

    As I never went to public school, I was wondering...what do they actually teach, and how is it wrong?
    They teach drivel called "social studies". Very little real history shows up in the typical high school curriculum.

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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Layla_Z View Post
    Do you realize that you are part of a larger society? Do you realize that it is in you best interest that those around you - doctor, lawyer, plumber, mechanic, store managers, truck drivers, etc. - are well educated? It is to your and everyone's benefit that we are an educated society.
    Yes, I'm fully aware that most of those around me are blood sucking leech-like socialist parasites.

    I'm in no ways obligated to willingly provide food for them, I require them to use the threat of violence before surrendering the least I can get away with.

    If they want to be "educated", they can pay their own tuitions.

  10. #80
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    Re: Role of government in Education

    Quote Originally Posted by NEUROSPORT View Post
    i'd love those around me to be knowledgeable and intelligent.

    but not "well educated"

    the word "education" to me is a curse word.

    you can learn, study or research. this implies HUNGER FOR KNOWLEDGE. but education means something else - it means FORCING YOUR VIEW ON SOMEBODY ELSE.

    knowledge should come from curiosity and experience. not from indoctrination.
    Education does not mean that. It means a basic foundation of knowledge on which to build. Of course children should be taught to think for themselves and be encouraged to continue to seek knowledge. Being well educated doesn't mean you are done and don't need to learn more.
    ~Fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity.
    ~I have as much authority as the Pope, I just don't have as many people who believe it.
    ~If all the world is a stage, where is the audience sitting?
    George Carlin

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