View Poll Results: What's your opinion of Affirmative Action in the college admissions process?

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  • I'm in favor of affirmative action.

    9 13.64%
  • I don't think it should be used for criteria.

    52 78.79%
  • I have no opinion.

    1 1.52%
  • Other (please explain)

    4 6.06%
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Thread: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

  1. #51
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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by NortheastCynic View Post
    Just out of curiosity, what is a 'professional Black'?

    -NC
    Jesse Jackson

    Al Sharpton

    Obama

    Perfessor Bates of Hahvahd.

    Bill Clinton, our first Black President.

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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Do you honestly think that the value of an individual to a classroom/educational institution can be completely encapsulated by a number and a resume?
    The institution is being paid to provide value to the student.

  3. #53
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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by SA
    Who gets to decide the limits of zealotry of this racism, the victim or the beneficiary?
    How about we do this, I"ll answer this question and you can go back and answer the following: "How would you promote diversity at a University?"

    Regarding your question: the Administration of a University determines the degree to which they utilize a diversification program. They are, after all, responsible for the University's 'customers'.

    Quote Originally Posted by SA
    How many blacks need reverse racism to get into a course of study as useless as African American Studies? Answer: None.
    If you believe that simply being black is sufficient enough to be accepted into an AA Studies program then you are mistaken.

    Quote Originally Posted by SA
    How many people wanting to study something as useless as Islam would enroll in a university with no specimens to study? If they're that stupid, then it's their problem, and guess what? It doesn't justify racism.

    Basicly, you can't define your acceptance of racism, and you have to come up with bogus examples.
    Please. You began this particular off-shoot by giving examples of classes where diversity is, in your view, unnecessary, I simply responded. It isn't my concern if you do not like my examples. I'll ask again, can you see no instance in which diversity aids the learning process? I've defined my parameters for a proper diversification program several times, particularly in my discussion with NYC. Go back and read it if you'd like.

    Quote Originally Posted by SA
    A qualified white med-school applicant is passed over for a lesser qualified black applicant (we are now discussing how Affirmative Action really works, not your fantasy land of wonderful loving people). How does a black freshman from an American high school add useful "die-versity" to the medical school experience?
    If you'd read my parameters for a good diversification program you would know that I do not support the acceptance of an inferior minority student over a better white student. Evidently you haven't.

    -NC
    Last edited by NortheastCynic; 07-26-09 at 05:15 PM.

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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    this i s bad idea.the only universitet you can get to i n Québec that is english language i s Mcgill.all universitet you must speak french.

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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Do you honestly think that the value of an individual to a classroom/educational institution can be completely encapsulated by a number and a resume?

    There are plenty of very good reasons for wanting students with a diversity of views, races, socio-economic statuses, and backgrounds.

    A school composed of 100 rich white conservative guys from Greenwich is going to be a pretty ****ing boring school, as would be a school of 100 poor black liberal women from Bed-Stuy. The students at each of those schools would leave with a diminished ability to see other viewpoints and interact with different types of individuals.
    Just a number? No. Just a resume? No. Both together along with a questionaire? Yes.

    And what is boring and what is not is subjective.

    There are other ways to learn about peoples viewpoints. Even in school. For example teaching about other cultures, having successful, and even not so successfull folks come in to talk to the class while the students ask questions.

    When not in school life itself will bring various people of various cultures into a persons life. You learn your whole life. Not just while in school.

    Lets put it this way. Who's going to work harder. The person that had everything handed to them? Or the person that worked hard to get where they are. AA hands things to people that don't deserve them because they did not work for it. It is the person that will work harder that will help out the community more than the person that had things handed to them.

    Being the minority race in a country is no excuse for AA. With out AA everyone in this country has the same chance to go some place. If they work for it. It doesn't matter if you're white, black, hispanic, asian, arab, or a purple and pink polka dotted being from the planet Zeneb.

    With AA people get things handed to them just because they are of a different race. How does that sound fair to all those that didn't get picked even though they had better grades, better attitude, and a better work ethic, than the one who had it handed to him/her on a plate took the only available spot open.
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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    It's incredibly counter productive when it's based exclusively on race.

    Is Affirmative Action at Law School Actually Hurting Minorities? - Law Blog - WSJ



    I believe that a limited form of AA based on things like class, race, background, etc. can serve the purpose of increasing diversity, which is indeed a valuable concern.
    To level I agree.

    If we ask ourselves WHY exactly there is AA it is not because of race directly, but because the people who are minorities have a smaller ownership of wealth compared to their population then whites.

    So... if anything AA should give prefference to children of POOR parents. I think a white child who is stuck in the cycle of poverty is as bad as any other child in that situation.

    The degree in which AA for wealth can be argued, but I suppose some form of prefference for those people, if a schools allows it, is acceptable.

    I am not too completely sure though.

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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    A qualified white med-school applicant is passed over for a lesser qualified black applicant (we are now discussing how Affirmative Action really works, not your fantasy land of wonderful loving people). How does a black freshman from an American high school add useful "die-versity" to the medical school experience?

    Correct answer: it doesn't.
    Presumably, because the black med student has:

    1) Struggled harder than the average white med student, and thus has an equal or superior level of intelligence and ability to succeed if those obstacles had not been there, and
    2) Will improve the medical field as a whole by increasing the number of black doctors, which has an impact on how black patients are treated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    The institution is being paid to provide value to the student.
    And the institution can do whatever the **** it wants with its money.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Just a number? No. Just a resume? No. Both together along with a questionaire? Yes.

    And what is boring and what is not is subjective.
    No, white guys from Greenwich are objectively boring.

    There are other ways to learn about peoples viewpoints. Even in school. For example teaching about other cultures, having successful, and even not so successfull folks come in to talk to the class while the students ask questions.
    Yea, having a token successful black come in to speak to a bunch of white kids will definitely have the same impact as the white kids living, studying, hanging out, and attending class with other black kids.

    When not in school life itself will bring various people of various cultures into a persons life. You learn your whole life. Not just while in school.

    Lets put it this way. Who's going to work harder. The person that had everything handed to them? Or the person that worked hard to get where they are. AA hands things to people that don't deserve them because they did not work for it. It is the person that will work harder that will help out the community more than the person that had things handed to them.
    This of course assumes that the average person receiving AA simply sat on their ass and did no work to get where they are.

    With AA people get things handed to them just because they are of a different race. How does that sound fair to all those that didn't get picked even though they had better grades, better attitude, and a better work ethic, than the one who had it handed to him/her on a plate took the only available spot open.
    Probably as bad as it feels to be someone who doesn't get the one open job because a company decides against giving them an interview due to a "black" name.

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    To level I agree.

    If we ask ourselves WHY exactly there is AA it is not because of race directly, but because the people who are minorities have a smaller ownership of wealth compared to their population then whites.

    So... if anything AA should give prefference to children of POOR parents. I think a white child who is stuck in the cycle of poverty is as bad as any other child in that situation.

    The degree in which AA for wealth can be argued, but I suppose some form of prefference for those people, if a schools allows it, is acceptable.

    I am not too completely sure though.
    I would agree with this to a large degree.
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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Great Idea, give a small number of people the power to decide admissions based on nothing but race. Give a small number of people the power to decide who is black and who is white based on nothing but their opinons. Is a person with 1/2 African American blood, black? 1/4,1/8,1/16? Is the tone of the color the deciding factor? If so how dark is considered black? What is latino? Is a white person born In Puerto Rico Latino? Is an African immigrant considered Black? If so, then why do they deserve a special adjustment if they never were victims of slavery?


    THE GREATEST FREEDOM IS THE FREEDOM TO OPPRESS OTHERS

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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by NortheastCynic View Post
    How about we do this, I"ll answer this question and you can go back and answer the following: "How would you promote diversity at a University?"
    I wouldn't promote diversity, it's a bull**** issue.

    I would promote academic excellence.

    It's the guy standing in front of the class that's paid to teach, not the students.


    Quote Originally Posted by NortheastCynic View Post
    Regarding your question: the Administration of a University determines the degree to which they utilize a diversification program. They are, after all, responsible for the University's 'customers'.
    And all that means is the school gets to determine how racist they want to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by NortheastCynic View Post
    If you believe that simply being black is sufficient enough to be accepted into an AA Studies program then you are mistaken.
    Yes, many times now they also have to have a hispanic name, just to confuse things.

    Quote Originally Posted by NortheastCynic View Post
    Please. You began this particular off-shoot by giving examples of classes where diversity is, in your view, unnecessary, I simply responded. It isn't my concern if you do not like my examples. I'll ask again, can you see no instance in which diversity aids the learning process? I've defined my parameters for a proper diversification program several times, particularly in my discussion with NYC. Go back and read it if you'd like.
    There's no such thing as a "proper" diversification program, there's only racism.

    Quote Originally Posted by NortheastCynic View Post
    If you'd read my parameters for a good diversification program you would know that I do not support the acceptance of an inferior minority student over a better white student. Evidently you haven't.
    Evidently you don't understand how Affirmative Action works in the real world.

    If the applicant isn't academically inferior, there's no need to give him special favors based on his skin color or other silly and equally irrelevant parameters.

    The ONLY point of Affirmative Action is to shove the academically inferior applicant into a class he does not belong in. They can call it diversity to make it sound like they're doing something besides filling racial quotas, and the saps can fall for that if they want, but the truth is...they're filling quotas.

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    Re: Affirmative Action (in college admissions): Good idea or Bad idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    To level I agree.

    If we ask ourselves WHY exactly there is AA it is not because of race directly, but because the people who are minorities have a smaller ownership of wealth compared to their population then whites.

    So... if anything AA should give prefference to children of POOR parents. I think a white child who is stuck in the cycle of poverty is as bad as any other child in that situation.

    The degree in which AA for wealth can be argued, but I suppose some form of prefference for those people, if a schools allows it, is acceptable.

    I am not too completely sure though.


    If we ask ourselves why we're stuck with Affirmative Action, we discover that enough politicians sold out to buy minority votes to make it happen.

    That's why.

    It is a racist program in complete violation of the Fourteenth Amendment's guarantee of equal protection before the law.

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