View Poll Results: Should women be allowed to specialize as infantry

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  • Yes, and they should be integrated with the males

    101 57.71%
  • Yes, but keep their units seperate from male units

    16 9.14%
  • No, but women should be given some basic infantry skills beyond basic training

    33 18.86%
  • No, women should never serve in a role where they may encounter combat

    15 8.57%
  • Other....

    10 5.71%
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Thread: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

  1. #651
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by G.I. Joe View Post
    It's excusable for your wife to be a liberal. She's a woman. For a grown man to be a liberal, however, is absolutely pathetic. I can understand if you're some teenage pothead with no concept of how the world works, but when you grow up and put man pants on its time to earn your own money and tell the government that you can take care of yourself.
    Just don't make such sweeping generalizations. I know loons and fine people on both sides even though I tend to be more conservative.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
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  2. #652
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by G.I. Joe View Post
    It's excusable for your wife to be a liberal. She's a woman. For a grown man to be a liberal, however, is absolutely pathetic. I can understand if you're some teenage pothead with no concept of how the world works, but when you grow up and put man pants on its time to earn your own money and tell the government that you can take care of yourself.
    Moderator's Warning:
    Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military? This stops now. Way off topic and insulting
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  3. #653
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    If 95 white people and 4 black people took a written test, say a test to get into college, and all four black people plus "a few" of the white people failed it, would that prove that all black people are unsuited for higher education?
    Would it be reasonable or fair to assume that "if ten black people had taken the test, all ten would've failed it"?
    Not the same thing at all. You are attempting to compare mental strength to physical strength while mixing some racial garbage within. What I wrote, if you cared to put the "Spice Girl" baton down, was that only a very few would be able to handle the rigors of infantry life. I even offerred up an idea to allow women to be in the infantry.

    What you are purposefully failing to acknowledge is that I speak from experience. Ever gone on the "Slide for Life" or any other obstacle on the Confidence Course? Or ran through the Marine Obstacle Course? They can be serious gut checks for some. The vast majority of women simply cannot do it. And if they cannot do it, then how in hell would they be able to be in the infantry?

    Only the very few would be able to do it.
    Last edited by MSgt; 08-07-09 at 01:16 AM.

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  4. #654
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Just don't make such sweeping generalizations. I know loons and fine people on both sides even though I tend to be more conservative.
    Silly, my wife (Kelzie) is a liberal and she is a loon. Embrace the loon in your wife, dude. She keeps me honest. Otherwise I would storm a beach somewhere and set up a right winged dictatorship.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by GySgt View Post
    Silly, my wife (Kelzie) is a liberal and she is a loon. Embrace the loon in your wife, dude. She keeps me honest. Otherwise I would storm a beach somewhere and set up a right winged dictatorship.



    Bro, We stormed a beach last last week, and all the wife let me set up were the umbrella's, towels, and a cooler......


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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by GySgt View Post
    Silly, my wife (Kelzie) is a liberal and she is a loon. Embrace the loon in your wife, dude. She keeps me honest. Otherwise I would storm a beach somewhere and set up a right winged dictatorship.
    My wife is intelligent and not a loon. You can celebrate your wifes loneness if you like but leave my wife out of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  7. #657
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by GySgt View Post
    Absolutely. Now, more often than not, the male ego is at stake and the "He-Man-Woman-Hater-Club" or argument of "tradition" is in effect. However, the truth is that some women are absolutely tough enough to be 0300s. They are few, but they do exist.

    I believe the Marine Corps made a mistake in 1997(?) Before this, women went from Boot Camp to their MOS schools and followed up with basic infantry training once they got to the fleet. Then came a much needed breakthrough. The Commandant instructed Training Command (TECOM) to make room for the women. In 1997 (or '96), the first female Marines graduated Boot Camp and went to Marine Combat Training (MCT) and then went to MOS school just like the men. However, this is where they made a mistake. The women were thrown in with the men and the training quickly became less intensive to accomodate the abilities of the women. (18 mile hikes became 12 mile hikes, run paces slowed, etc.) By the end of the year, the women were seperated out into their own training commands along side the men, so that they could receive training in accordance to their abilities and the men could get back on track.

    The dark side of this is that this is now used to "prove" that women can't do it. But this is a general mood. There are plenty who believe that if a woman truley wishes to live the life of the infantry, then she should be able to at least take some sort of indoc to prove capabilities. This, of course, couldn't be something where she could work towards taking, because there must be a natural baseline ability present. The reason is because the rigors of being in the infantry don't stop and there must be a base line of strength and endurance.

    But there would be other considerations. Logistics would be tough. The infantry is not constructed for "coed." We watch Battlestar Galactica or Starship Troopers or Aliens or movies of the like where men and women dress together in locker rooms, but this isn't practical in our society.

    I believe it is do-able. But ultimately, its our politicians that have to approve of something like this. Combat training is one thing. Sending women on patrols where enemy is imminent is another. I don't think America is ready to stomach dead American women on CNN.





    Absolutely welcome.
    Again I agree with all you have to say on the subject simply because it is obvious you know the situation form all angles are are a fair and equitable person when consideing the question form all sides with intelligence and experience.

    As far as the logistics of women in the infantry things haven't changed much and it is a factor. When I was in the Nationa Guard a long time ago and we were in the field I was the only women and the logistics there was to put me in a barricks all by myself not equiped with heat in the dead of winter. It was all they could come up with. So that is another valid point you have made.

    Unfortunately many people are more intrested in proving their point than in knowing the facts on the issue and the result is personl attacks on the person who shows them up to be wrong. Kind of like the military you have to be ready for combat at all times.

  8. #658
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    That's right. There's a huge difference between being embedded with a combat unit and being an actual combat soldier.
    Although technically IAF, my entire military service upon graduation was spent embedded with IDF combat forces. I accompanied them into active battle three times. Gaza x 2, and most recently Lebanon. Advancing the notion that being embedded entitles one to some sort of silver-spoon treatment is the height of ignorance. I can assure you, every trial and tribulation in IDF combat units is equally distributed.

    One of my brothers is USAF. Due to his MOS and experience, he is usually embedded with a Green Beret A-Team. He has done numerous tours in Iraq, Afghanistan, and other unspecified nations. Once again, the suggestion that being embedded entitles one to be slack-jockey is not only erroneous, but ludicrous.

    Just wanted to rectify any false impressions occassioned by the quote above.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by smartaleck View Post
    Thanks so much for the really informing us on this question of women in the infantry. It is great that someone with your actuall experience has taken the time to infom us on on this subject. We couldn't ask for anyone more able to teach us here on the subject and as far as I'm concerned we will not get any more informed than this. I'm really happy you posted to this question.
    Jesus Christ! You've had people who served as infantry telling you the same thing as Gunny the whole time! Why is his opinion all of sudden so super great to you?

  10. #660
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by pro-bipartisan View Post
    It should be based on performance, not gender; If a woman could do the job better than a man then let's do it.
    It's not about ability. Why can't people at least go so far as educating themselves on that point, before screaming that females should serve in combat arms units?

    Quote Originally Posted by smartaleck View Post
    Thanks so much for the really informing us on this question of women in the infantry. It is great that someone with your actuall experience has taken the time to infom us on on this subject. We couldn't ask for anyone more able to teach us here on the subject and as far as I'm concerned we will not get any more informed than this. I'm really happy you posted to this question.

    First of all I being a woman really did want to be informed on this subject It only takes a little resoning on anyones part to realize women are not physically fit to do the job of a grunt as some stated. The problem I had was their might me a few women that could do it and that they should be able to at least try . Just because I knew the majority of women couldn't do it didn't make it fair that the few women who could do it couldn't get a fair chance to prove it one way or the other.

    I like you idea that maybe their could be a special indoc for women who met the standards to be grunts. I"m really happy that you would be willing to give them a chance. most women cannot do the physical parts of being a grunt because nature has made them smaller and with less muscle mass but their are a few women that does not apply but like you said probably only a few.

    It is so nice to know that someone in charge of women and men in the military has such a open mind and a willingness to give women the same chance as a man. I know men can incourage women to do thier best and you are one of those people..

    I'm glad that women get to prove themselves one way or the other. Doesn't matter to me as long as they get the chance. It's nice to know that our kids both male and female in the military have someone like you to lead them.

    Thank you so much for all you have sacrificed to be in the military. I for one am a grateful citizen. Thanks
    You've been told time and again, by actual veterans, why females aren't allowed in combat arms units.


    Quote Originally Posted by 1069 View Post
    If 95 white people and 4 black people took a written test, say a test to get into college, and all four black people plus "a few" of the white people failed it, would that prove that all black people are unsuited for higher education?
    Would it be reasonable or fair to assume that "if ten black people had taken the test, all ten would've failed it"?
    We're not talking about college. We're talking about the battlefield, where people really die and the security and safety of our country is really at stake. I, for one, don't believe that political correctness is a good enough reason to jeopardize people's lives.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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