View Poll Results: Should women be allowed to specialize as infantry

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  • Yes, and they should be integrated with the males

    101 57.71%
  • Yes, but keep their units seperate from male units

    16 9.14%
  • No, but women should be given some basic infantry skills beyond basic training

    33 18.86%
  • No, women should never serve in a role where they may encounter combat

    15 8.57%
  • Other....

    10 5.71%
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Thread: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

  1. #581
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    mispost.............
    Last edited by G.I. Joe; 08-05-09 at 04:34 PM.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Well lookit you Mr. G.I. Joe. If you ain't the biggest baddest dude on the DP block! Even got yerself a username and crappy avatar to puff your bad stuff. My oh my. But it's been my experience that those who need to publicly flex usually know the least.
    Wow, great post with no substance. You present the "guys who drive hummers have small cocks" argument.

    BTW, the vast majority of the military disagrees with your stance on women in combat. Maybe you should focus on that for a bit.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Most men here (and most have never served) seem to imagine modern Combat as Vic Morrow leading his platoon of merry men through Europe circa 1944 with bayonets attached to their single-fire carbines. Most of you don't have a clue how a modern, integrated, and well trained military engages the enemy.
    Soldier circa 1944 weren't using single shot carbines. American infantry soldiers then were armed with some of the finest and most reliable light and heavy infantry weapons in the history of the world: M1 Garand, M1 Carbine, Browning light and heavy machine guns, flamethrowers, 1903 Springfield sniper rifles, Thompson Submachine guns. Some of those weapons, such as the M2 BMG are still in use.

    SURVSATS. ELINT. Saturation shelling. Strafing. Drones with real-time video and more sensors than an F-16. GPS keypad gridding. 3-D structure layouts. Laser designators. Wireless laptops. Satellite up/down comm links. Special Forces inserts. Sniper team inserts. Recon team inserts. Spotter aircraft. Thunder runs. Armored spearheads. Chopper support. Close-Air-Support officers. All this before the Infantry even get out of their transports.

    Hand-to-hand combat? wtf?
    And, all that high-tech crap will never replace that infantry soldier and his rifle using speed, tactics, terrain and firepower to close with the enemy destroy him in close quarter combat. All the things you listed are combat multipliers and aren't neccessarily deployed/employed prior to deployment of an element's main body. The nature of the battlefield will never change no matter how much technology you through into it. Technology breaks, gets wet and stops working, gets dirty and malfunctions. IMO, the worst thing that happened to infantry platoon leaders was to give them GPS's. Before I ETS'ed in 2000, I ran across 1LT's and Captains that couldn't use a map and a compass because they'd become too accustomed to using their GPS. They had forgotten the most basic land navigation skills.

    As to the topic, though. I'm all for females serving in an military unit they choose. However, I believe that there shouldn't be any co-ed combat units. Infantry, armor, combat engineer and artillery units should be all male, or all female. In fact, I'm a proponent of that policy across the board.
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Doesnt matter where you are. The doctrine is the same. Intelligence, speed, mobility, and power projection. This notion of manly endurance and hiking through the countryside is total bs. Virtually all modern Infantry are mounted. Humvees and trucks or chopper ferries. You're gonna get your ass chewed up in anyone's back yard moving and fighting in slo-mo.
    Those vehicles are only used to get the infantry soldiers close to the battlefield. It would suicide to haul troops onto the battlefield in a thin skinned vehicle; goes against all modern battle doctrine. The same thing goes for Bradleys and Strykers. Those are lightly armored vehicles and aren't intended to be used as main battle tanks. Another problem with dismounting infantry soldiers actually on the battlefield, is that they will be exposed directly to enemy fires immediately upon dismounting the vehicle. The enemy will literally shoot them as they exit the troop ramp. Your idea of how heavy mechinized infantry units operate is mistaken.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    What about fully-combat units that only engage in quick assaults/operations?
    It seems to me that you only have a problem with sending females to the units that are required to stay in the battlefield and survive through harsh conditions.
    No. I was attached (be it briefly) to a ranger unit while in the guard, and no it would not work well.
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    What about fully-combat units that only engage in quick assaults/operations?
    It seems to me that you only have a problem with sending females to the units that are required to stay in the battlefield and survive through harsh conditions.
    There's no way that an assaulting unit will, with 100% certainty, be able to immediately break contact once they engaged.

    There's an old saying in the miltiary, "No plan survives first contact with the enemy".
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Unfortunately, I think quite a few look at this through a soda straw. You see what you want to see and ignore the bigger picture. Same old same old.
    In my opinion it is you ignoring the big picture.

    In every war in US history females have contributed without being in combat arms. The problem is the amount of females that could actually do the job is so minuscule in the end, it would be pointless to make such sweeping changes for so few. The money and moral would be harshly effected. It is as I said just not worth it.

    I know it stinks, but not everything in life is fair, get used to it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    The US military is not suited for occupation. No modern military is. The cost in blood, treasure, and equipment in Iraq is staggering. Occupation is what any modern military does least best. If you wish to reprise this experience again and again down the road, be my guest. But the extant results will be fairly consistent.
    The Iraq War is nearly complete, and with relatively small amounts of KIA's. America does occupation very well, the best in the world. Not that I want to make a habit of such things but it's not like we can make a policy of avoiding occupation altogether.

    What I am suggesting, and what has been proven true in other parts of the world, is that females can indeed contribute significantly on the modern battlefield. No, females generally can't hump thirty miles lugging a SAW. But if your military finds it necessary for any Infantry soldiers to do this, then your military is in some deep **** from the get-go. Such exacting excercises are best left to elite personel such as Special Forces.
    Nobody's lugging a SAW thirty miles, I can assure you, but they are lugging it, along with their combat load (typically 60-75 lbs), sometimes up to eight miles, in 140 degree weather, after having very little sleep. This is kind of thing is an eventuality, not a mere possibility.

    Aggressive and sustained patrolling / ambushes are the best medicine for counter-insurgency operations. It's my personal opinion that woman lack the physical stamina necessary to conduct prolonged combat operations of this sort. Sure, there may be a few women who are capable of such, but we do not radically change military policy based upon the exceptions.

    Intelligence, speed, mobility, and combined-arms capability are the keys to successful ground operations. Getting bogged down kills. I suppose some muscle-bound tattooed grunt has to lug a friggin SAW around. But me? I'll take the female soldier who can obliterate anything two clicks away using a lightweight headset, laser designator, and laptop.
    Do the terrorists slip the coordinates to their location in Uncle Sam's mailbox? What happens when this bad mamma can't locate any targets? What happens when the target is in the middle of the city?

    You see Ethereal, one need not be the strongest and baddest dude on the block to be extremely proficcient and successful at killing the enemy. This ability can come in any size, or gender.
    I don't doubt this but for certain jobs one needs certain tools. Bases don't build themselves, posts don't stand themselves, LP/OP's don't collect intel by themselves, doors don't get kicked in by themselves, etc.

    I know I probably sound like a dick but it's just the opinion I have after my experience in the Marines. I was a wrestler and a distance runner before I was in the Marines and I still had a hell of time over there, physically speaking.

    I don't doubt that women could fill roles as combat specialists of some sort, but as generalized infantry I just can't see it. At least, thatís my two cents.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    While my opposition to females serving in combat units, especially infantry units isn't about ability, it is a fact that a 115 pound woman isn't going to be able to perform some tasks. If females are ever allowed to serve in infantry units, they should have to perform all tasks to the same standards as male soldiers; no gener norming.



    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by G.I. Joe View Post
    Wow, great post with no substance. You present the "guys who drive hummers have small cocks" argument.

    BTW, the vast majority of the military disagrees with your stance on women in combat. Maybe you should focus on that for a bit.
    Tashah is a seasoned military person, and as such brings a point of view that maybe old white dudes of an antiquated mindset do not get
    did you know gays are not allowed to serve openly in the military?
    do you really think those same people would come to a better conclusion when it comes to women?
    maybe you should focus on that for a bit

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    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

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