View Poll Results: Should women be allowed to specialize as infantry

Voters
175. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, and they should be integrated with the males

    101 57.71%
  • Yes, but keep their units seperate from male units

    16 9.14%
  • No, but women should be given some basic infantry skills beyond basic training

    33 18.86%
  • No, women should never serve in a role where they may encounter combat

    15 8.57%
  • Other....

    10 5.71%
Page 51 of 88 FirstFirst ... 41495051525361 ... LastLast
Results 501 to 510 of 877

Thread: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

  1. #501
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Like I said it is a whole list of things. Can you see to people in a combat unit being involved protected sex or not? It would be a disaster.
    First off, they shouldn't be to begin with. They should be able to control themselves or they shouldn't be soldiers.

    Secondly, how would it be a "disaster"?


    Oh that is not a sexist statement without any evidence to back it up.
    All you guys use said arguments for the reasons women shouldn't be there. Don't call me sexist for saying you all need to grow the **** up.

    Let's see... two main arguments from the men:
    1) The men will want to "protect" the women (problem with the men, not the women)
    2)The men will be distracted (problem with the men, not the women)

    So, the men are the ones making arguments that puts THEM as being the people with the problem, not the women.

  2. #502
    User smartaleck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Central Florida
    Last Seen
    09-01-09 @ 01:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    79

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So your saying you and other females had to road march with a 249 SAW or a m240,m60,35 pound ruck sack,24 hour road march and a 5 mile run and do the same amount and quality of push ups as your male counterparts for your age group as well as the same amount of time for your two mile run as your male counterparts for your age group? Considering the fact US Army infantry basic training is only at Fort Benning last time I checked I know you were not held to the same standards. So either they lowered the training for males at Fort Jackson or where ever else they have P.O.G. basic training, had separate basic training from the males or you are full of it.





    No they don't.Maybe in the marines but even then to pass a pt test the standards are not the same.



    United States Marine Corps Physical Fitness Test - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Male PRT Standards

    Female PRT Standards



    U.S. Army Physical Fitness Chart - Males (Ages 17-21)

    U.S. Army Physical Fitness Chart - Females (Ages 17-21)

    Go to google and check out what the different standards for male and female Marines are. The only difference between requirements for male and female marines is: Males have to do : Dead hang pull ups and women Marines have to do Flex arm hand pull ups. I do believe the physical requirements for the Marines are more physically demading than the Army.

  3. #503
    King Of The Dog Pound
    Black Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    South Florida
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    34,548

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    First off, they shouldn't be to begin with. They should be able to control themselves or they shouldn't be soldiers.
    This is a ridicules statement. The average age of male and female soldiers is 19 to 20. This makes about as much sense as abstinence only programs.

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Secondly, how would it be a "disaster"?
    King, Charles A. The Trivialization of Gender and Its Impact on combat Effectiveness. Carlisle Barracks, PA, U.S. Army War College, 2000. 32 p.
    Despite changing social imperatives and the demonstrated performance of women in the service the central issue remains - are combat organizations better served by gender integration and the attendant trivialization of gender? In order to bring fresh perspective to the issue, principles of complexity theory are applied to the question. In this context, it is evident that disregarding the essential nature of gender differences and their impact on relationships adversely effects a combat organizations ability to deal with the stress and chaos of war. The paper concludes that unrestricted gender integration is not in the best interest of the military or the society that it serves.
    http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc...c=GetTRDoc.pdf

    The link is to the full paper.

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    All you guys use said arguments for the reasons women shouldn't be there. Don't call me sexist for saying you all need to grow the **** up.
    I am calling it sexist because you are blaming it on men. It works both ways.

    You say “ALL you guys” as if I said anything about it. Please point it out?

    Your comment is sexist whether you like it or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Let's see... two main arguments from the men:
    1) The men will want to "protect" the women (problem with the men, not the women)
    2)The men will be distracted (problem with the men, not the women)
    These are not the main arguments, although they could be part of the larger problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    So, the men are the ones making arguments that puts THEM as being the people with the problem, not the women.
    This has nothing to do with my argument or this debate and is nothing more than fallacy again. Your comment was sexist as it does work both ways.
    Last edited by Black Dog; 07-15-09 at 02:57 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  4. #504
    King Of The Dog Pound
    Black Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    South Florida
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    34,548

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by smartaleck View Post
    Go to google and check out what the different standards for male and female Marines are. The only difference between requirements for male and female marines is: Males have to do : Dead hang pull ups and women Marines have to do Flex arm hand pull ups. I do believe the physical requirements for the Marines are more physically demading than the Army.
    Actually allot of differences exist.

    "To earn a perfect PFT score of 300 points, a male must do 20 pull-ups, 100 crunches in less than two minutes, and complete the three mile run in 18 minutes or less. A female perfect score is 70 seconds on the flexed arm hang, 100 crunches, and a 21 minute three mile run. Marines who score above a 285 receive certifications as an award for their higher than average fitness."

    Male 100 Crunches in under 2 mins. Female 100 Crunches no time limit.
    Male 20 Pull Ups. Female 70 secs hanging in the flex arm position.
    Male 18 min 2 mile run. Female 21 min 3 mile run.

    Sorry that is a huge difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  5. #505
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    This is a ridicules statement. The average age of male and female soldiers is 19 to 20. This makes about as much sense as abstinence only programs.
    I still don't see the problem.


    King, Charles A. The Trivialization of Gender and Its Impact on combat Effectiveness. Carlisle Barracks, PA, U.S. Army War College, 2000. 32 p.
    Despite changing social imperatives and the demonstrated performance of women in the service the central issue remains - are combat organizations better served by gender integration and the attendant trivialization of gender? In order to bring fresh perspective to the issue, principles of complexity theory are applied to the question. In this context, it is evident that disregarding the essential nature of gender differences and their impact on relationships adversely effects a combat organizations ability to deal with the stress and chaos of war. The paper concludes that unrestricted gender integration is not in the best interest of the military or the society that it serves.
    http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc...c=GetTRDoc.pdf

    The link is to the full paper.
    I have no doubt at all that it's a wonderfully written sexist document.


    I am calling it sexist because you are blaming it on men. It works both ways.
    I'm blaming it on men by quoting the same arguments they use? ROFL

    You say “ALL you guys” as if I said anything about it. Please point it out?
    I don't feel like re-reading every post in this thread. It's the most common so-called argument from men I've heard on any forum.

    Your comment is sexist whether you like it or not.
    Not my fault men use sexist arguments. I'm just quoting what they say.


    These are not the main arguments, although they could be part of the larger problem.
    Yes, they are. Both are rampant in this thread and every other on the subject.

    This has nothing to do with my argument or this debate and is nothing more than fallacy again. Your comment was sexist as it does work both ways.
    What works both ways? The men using those arguments? I don't see women using those arguments. So what is it that works both ways?

  6. #506
    King Of The Dog Pound
    Black Dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    South Florida
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    34,548

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    I still don't see the problem.

    I have no doubt at all that it's a wonderfully written sexist document.

    I'm blaming it on men by quoting the same arguments they use? ROFL

    I don't feel like re-reading every post in this thread. It's the most common so-called argument from men I've heard on any forum.

    Not my fault men use sexist arguments. I'm just quoting what they say.

    Yes, they are. Both are rampant in this thread and every other on the subject.

    What works both ways? The men using those arguments? I don't see women using those arguments. So what is it that works both ways?
    No evidence and nothing but more fallacy. I give up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  7. #507
    DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Israel
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:55 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    17,211

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    No one person is equal to another when it comes to important issues such as combat. We cannot base our judgment on the value of individual equality.

    That's why we have training to weed out those who cannot perform adequately. Women should be set to the same standards as men for that very reason.
    The infantry training is supposed to simulate the combat itself.
    If a female can pass those trainings on the same level a male is expected to, then go ahead and approve her into the infantry.
    But if we'd find out that women-only stuff such as period and pregnancy prevent the females from doing their job correctly, then by no means should women be approved into infantry army service.

    Also, I find it hard to believe that a female would be able to withstand staying in an uncomfortable position with the weapon loaded and ready to fire for hours without moving and without making a sound.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

  8. #508
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    The infantry training is supposed to simulate the combat itself.
    If a female can pass those trainings on the same level a male is expected to, then go ahead and approve her into the infantry.
    Good, then we agree.

    But if we'd find out that women-only stuff such as period and pregnancy prevent the females from doing their job correctly, then by no means should women be approved into infantry army service.
    Indeed. Just as if "men's only stuff" such as getting laid or erectile dysfunction or getting female soldiers pregnant or being worried about if their buddy is gay or not prevent them from doing their jobs correctly, then by on means should those men be approved into infantry service.

    Also, I find it hard to believe that a female would be able to withstand staying in an uncomfortable position with the weapon loaded and ready to fire for hours without moving and without making a sound.
    Why on earth would you find that hard to believe? For instance, I know plenty of female hunters who would disagree with you.

  9. #509
    DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Israel
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:55 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    17,211

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Indeed. Just as if "men's only stuff" such as getting laid
    lol wut
    Why on earth would you find that hard to believe? For instance, I know plenty of female hunters who would disagree with you.
    Hunters don't get to do what I'm talking about.
    I'm talking about a bunch of soldiers standing back to back in an uncomfortable position for all night long, ready to open fire in every little second and staying still without making a sound.
    I didn't know hunters do that.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

  10. #510
    Goddess of Bacon

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Charlottesville, VA
    Last Seen
    05-28-12 @ 09:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    13,988

    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    lol wut
    Hunters don't get to do what I'm talking about.
    I'm talking about a bunch of soldiers standing back to back in an uncomfortable position for all night long, ready to open fire in every little second and staying still without making a sound.
    I didn't know hunters do that.
    Hunters I know that use tree stands, stand still, silent, with a loaded gun for hours on end.

    Regardless, I fail to see why in the world anyone would think a woman incapable of standing still.

Page 51 of 88 FirstFirst ... 41495051525361 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •