View Poll Results: Should women be allowed to specialize as infantry

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  • Yes, and they should be integrated with the males

    101 57.71%
  • Yes, but keep their units seperate from male units

    16 9.14%
  • No, but women should be given some basic infantry skills beyond basic training

    33 18.86%
  • No, women should never serve in a role where they may encounter combat

    15 8.57%
  • Other....

    10 5.71%
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Thread: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

  1. #451
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    No it is not. being caught having sex in a barracks is a violation of most bases rules, and probably service rules. It's not exactly enforced much, we just ignored it when it happened mostly, but technically, neither sex can have sex in a barracks.
    We accept the rabid degree gays claim sexuality governs their lives but claim it irrelevant to heterosexuals. Not a surprising contradiction in the waves of social contradictions it which anything conventional is irrelevant or evil and anything counter culture is undeniable truisms resulting in the next collections of bigotries and discrimination.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    I did not understand the argument of "women can't serve with men because men would then want to protect them".
    I've been told a unit works the best when everyone is united and protect each other, so what's wrong in that?
    The major reason why the commander is always such an ass to everyone in the unit is because he wants to unite them against him, so the unit would work as one. Teamwork is essential in an infantry unit.

    Also, what's that bull about women not serving as infantry in the IDF?
    I have a friend who's serving as one.
    I see it even while remodeling kitchens.

    One small outfit I worked for a couple years ago had a woman, and she was damn good.

    We men didn't want to leave her by herself in some homes which were out of the city. Even if she was at a job in town, we would drive by and "see if she needed anything from the shop" if we were on our way there. Yeah, she was cute, and that was part of it (before you get any ideas, she was married and we respected that) but we were passively being protective of her.

    The men didn't do that with each other, we only did that with her.

    She saw our behavior for what it was, but since it was quite passive a we respected her as a professional, she passed it off as "cute" and used us to bring her Starbucks

    Gender never got in the way of the job getting don. Our protectiveness was there, but she could do and did every job that everyone else did. No one ever said "that counter is too heavy for you" or "we don't want you to be alone all day way out in the hills".

    Of course, that's not combat, that's remodeling, but I hope my personal experiences here help clarify what we're talking about
    Last edited by Jerry; 06-01-09 at 12:54 PM.

  3. #453
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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    We accept the rabid degree gays claim sexuality governs their lives but claim it irrelevant to heterosexuals. Not a surprising contradiction in the waves of social contradictions it which anything conventional is irrelevant or evil and anything counter culture is undeniable truisms resulting in the next collections of bigotries and discrimination.
    We accept that? Really?

    By the way, the discussion is women in the military, not gays in the military. Could you take your gay hating rants to a more appropriate thread please.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    We accept that? Really?

    By the way, the discussion is women in the military, not gays in the military. Could you take your gay hating rants to a more appropriate thread please.
    In each case you have soldiers sexually attracted to other soldiers in the same unit.

    Homosexual men have the neurological sexual attraction of heterosexual women, and I mean the same interpretation of the same pheromones by the same parts of the brain.

    When addressing how sexual attraction affects a unit, hetero women and gay men are the same thing.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    IWe men didn't want to leave her by herself in some homes which were out of the city. Even if she was at a job in town, we would drive by and "see if she needed anything from the shop" if we were on our way there. Yeah, she was cute, and that was part of it (before you get any ideas, she was married and we respected that) but we were passively being protective of her.
    It's up to women in that situation to make it clear that they are just peers, not walking vaginas.

    When I started working doing street gang intervention, some of the guys I worked with were incredibly protective. They didn't want me working with the worst, most dangerous kids. My lieutenant had to read them the riot act and tell them, "She was hired to work with THOSE KIDS. That is her job. Any questions?"

    And, over time, they realized they didn't have to protect me, I was doing a job that I chose to do and I understood the risks.

    It's a learning curve. Every time I got a new Lt., I had to educate that person all over again. The last one was the most frustrating for me, after five years of doing the job, he was insistent that I not be out alone in the community. Well, hell, there was really no other way for me to do my job. We had multiple throw downs until he finally agreed to just let me do the job I was hired to do.

    I really think that it just takes time. I think the natural inclination with guys, when you're one of the first females doing a job, is to be overly protective. That passes when they see that you can handle yourself.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    It's up to women in that situation to make it clear that they are just peers, not walking vaginas.

    When I started working doing street gang intervention, some of the guys I worked with were incredibly protective. They didn't want me working with the worst, most dangerous kids. My lieutenant had to read them the riot act and tell them, "She was hired to work with THOSE KIDS. That is her job. Any questions?"

    And, over time, they realized they didn't have to protect me, I was doing a job that I chose to do and I understood the risks.

    It's a learning curve. Every time I got a new Lt., I had to educate that person all over again. The last one was the most frustrating for me, after five years of doing the job, he was insistent that I not be out alone in the community. Well, hell, there was really no other way for me to do my job. We had multiple throw downs until he finally agreed to just let me do the job I was hired to do.

    I really think that it just takes time. I think the natural inclination with guys, when you're one of the first females doing a job, is to be overly protective. That passes when they see that you can handle yourself.
    It is a natural instinct, I hate it when men's attitude in this regard is considered by modern feminists as an obstacle to be overcome. We evolved it for a reason, it serves a legitimate purpose for the species in general even when it's not appropriate for some specific situations. Men can tone it down and give women the space to prove themselves. As you said, it passes when the men see that you can handle yourself. We do smiler with each other, only instead of being protective, we pick on each other until we prove that we can handle ourselves.
    Last edited by Jerry; 06-01-09 at 03:56 PM.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    It is a natural instinct and not chauvinistic. I hate it when men's attitude in this regard is considered an obstacle to be overcome. We evolved it for a reason. Men can tone it down and give women the space to prove themselves. As you said, it passes when the men see that you can handle yourself. We do smiler with each other, only instead of being protective, we pick on each other until we prove that we can handle ourselves.
    Yeah I noticed a lot of penis size comparisons over the years...

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    We accept that? Really?

    By the way, the discussion is women in the military, not gays in the military. Could you take your gay hating rants to a more appropriate thread please.
    Gays and those who decide to be socially correct by joining their emotions sometimes believe they are entitled to special rights to be obtained by throwing shouting name calling tantrums Ė confident they are shielded from any discipline for doing so. It is similar to a person having road rage courage safe within their vehicle traveling down the road. I credited it to failed parenting of that person as a child allowing the child to get his or her way in tantrums. Spoiled children that remain children as adults.

    With the issue of romance and sex of women jointly serving with men in the military, that question is exactly the same as homosexual men serving with men in the military.
    Obviously.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    It is a natural instinct, I hate it when men's attitude in this regard is considered by modern feminists as an obstacle to be overcome. We evolved it for a reason, it serves a legitimate purpose for the species in general even when it's not appropriate for some specific situations. Men can tone it down and give women the space to prove themselves. As you said, it passes when the men see that you can handle yourself. We do smiler with each other, only instead of being protective, we pick on each other until we prove that we can handle ourselves.
    I agree and disagree with Jerry. I agree that instinctively men are protective of women. However, that is men who have not been conditioned away from such natural instinct. I believe this also is seen in the military in the stronger men being defensive of a fellow soldier they see as weak. The strong protect the weak of their unit with and without gender context. It is similar to adult instinct to protect a child even if not their own.

    Unfortunately, we are virtually dinosaurs in that regards. While men, particularly teens, have mouth courage if they are in a shielded or not threatened situation, most are cowards and only concerned of themselves. Other than basic necessities such as food, water, shelter etc until recently the focus of my life was the ability to defend against and not fear men on a physical level. I have gone to the defense of women and more rare children including in punitive ways. The result, among others, was being arrested over half a dozen times for assault but no convictions. Apparently the police agreed to the punitive action and only questioned the degree of it.

    My motives in doing so are suspect and probably many including anger management issues, enjoying having excuse to do so, impressing women, fighting old battles on those men and ego issues. I like to think it also was out of a sense of justice in the jungle where there otherwise is no justice at all. It was gender oriented in that I would not hurt a woman to that degree if she was doing the same thing. You donít pop a woman in the mouth for mouthing off at you. That is exactly what you do to another man. Iím not sure where I stand on corporal punishment of a child. I do know where I stand on corporal punishment of a punk.

    I see no problem with women serving along side men in the military including the infantry. The protective natures of soldiers already is one of defensiveness of anyone in the unit seen as weaker so I donít see any real change it would bring in that regards. Fortunately the men in our military for the most part are men in that regards. In our civilian population there arenít many men in that way left.

    On the pregnancy issue I see on problem with requiring women to be on required birth control if in an infantry unit. If the woman doesnít like it, donít join.

    Equality needs to be equal and if women are to have equality and all male gender role rights, they should also share in the risk of dying in combat. Equal rights and benefits means equal duties and risks.

    Of all I have read on this forum the most insightful is the quote of Rat you put in your sig. I never cease to be amazed at the seeming extreme courage men post on this board intermixed with whining about how they are being picked on.

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    Re: Should females be allowed to specialize as infantry in the military?

    Now see, despite my support for women in the military, I'm not going to support this issue for the sake of "equality". Now don't get me wrong here, I think female infantry units would be great, but I don't give a rat's ass about so-called "equal rights" in this case.

    It's the military, you are there to protect rights, not express rights. The very last thing we need is more political correctness injected into the service.

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