View Poll Results: Will the CA courts overturn Prop 8?

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Thread: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

  1. #21
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    If it were about family as Jerry mentioned in another thread I would not mind it being overturned (don't see that happening though) but it's not. It is about social engineering.

    I have asked before and no one answered, so I will ask again.

    If in CA gay couples already gets all the rights, benefits etc of heterosexual couples, why is it they so desperately want it called marriage?


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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    If it were about family as Jerry mentioned in another thread I would not mind it being overturned (don't see that happening though) but it's not. It is about social engineering.

    I have asked before and no one answered, so I will ask again.

    If in CA gay couples already gets all the rights, benefits etc of heterosexual couples, why is it they so desperately want it called marriage?
    I had this same debate with my father the other day. This is how I see it.

    Take for example: Since the founding of our country white men were only allowed to marry one woman but all other minorities could marry three women. After decades of struggle it was decided "ok white men can now have two wives". While it is progress they are still have not achieved the "same" rights as others. They look at it as stopping 99% of the way and feel that the majority still wont give them the last little bit. At least this is how I precieve there view. While you or I may see it as the same and perhaps feel they should be happy with what they have achieved we would also be asking them to settle for just a little less then what we have.
    Last edited by Baralis; 05-24-09 at 01:53 PM.

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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
    That is what the people said about Roe v Wade and Doe v Bolton. The SCOTUS will have to hear this eventually. The ACLU and Lambda Law are already framing cases for just that occasion.
    They can frame it all they want, but the SC doesn't have to hear anything, and it's highly unlikely that the court would require the states to do anything here.

    Abortion is a completely different issue than gay marriage.
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    They can frame it all they want, but the SC doesn't have to hear anything, and it's highly unlikely that the court would require the states to do anything here.

    Abortion is a completely different issue than gay marriage.
    I guess we will see. If it comes to a constitutional disagreement the SCOTUS will eventually have to hear it.
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
    It is getting to the final days. The decision on CA's Prop 8 is coming up this week. Will the courts stand up for civil rights as they always have. Will they fight for the 4% of Americans that have no voice? Will they allow the mob rule that can be an ugly thing?

    I do believe that the courts will do the right thing and overturn Prop 8!
    The courts cannot "do the right thing" by overturning the legally expressed will of the voters, unless one wishes to believe that tyrannical governments are morally superior to republican government.

    Courts that routinely do so should probably be disbanded.

    It is my fervent hope that the courts will uphold the rule of law and refuse to overturn Proposition 8.

    If someone would like to see the measure reversed, I refer them to the proper legislative channels.

    In other words, such people should learn to make their case to their peers, not approach Unaccountable Authority as a lowly supplicant.

    Democratic self government is messy, inefficient, often slow and cumbersome. It is also superior to any other known system. I invite my Respected Opponents, no matter how error prone or misguided to come and slog through its muddy expanses with me, and to forbear the marble clad and sterile halls of Dictatorial Rule.
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    I had this same debate with my father the other day. This is how I see it.

    Take for example: Since the founding of our country white men were only allowed to marry one woman but all other minorities could marry three women. After decades of struggle it was decided "ok white men can now have two wives". While it is progress they are still have not achieved the "same" rights as others. They look at it as stopping 99% of the way and feel that the majority still wont give them the last little bit. At least this is how I precieve there view. While you or I may see it as the same and perhaps feel they should be happy with what they have achieved we would also be asking them to settle for just a little less then what we have.
    That last little bit is nothing but a name.

    Again and even in your example it is nothing but trying to make something look legitimate when a majority of society does not feel it is.

    It still looks like social engineering and has little to do with the family.


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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    That last little bit is nothing but a name.

    I agree the last little bit is nothing but a name. So why not give them the name and make them happy. The way I see it having homosexual unions labeled marriage or civil union will have no affect in my life.

    On a side note, I dont think it is the governments place to dictate personal relationships. I dont think the government should be involved in any way what so ever other then to protect personal rights. Its up to the individual to determine what they consider marriage.

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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    I agree the last little bit is nothing but a name. So why not give them the name and make them happy. The way I see it having homosexual unions labeled marriage or civil union will have no affect in my life.
    The political side of me says I agree. The Christian side says go ahead with civil unions but it is not marriage.

    I have admitted before I am torn on this issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    On a side note, I dont think it is the governments place to dictate personal relationships. I dont think the government should be involved in any way what so ever other then to protect personal rights. Its up to the individual to determine what they consider marriage.
    Absolutely, I have said as much myself. Could not agree more.


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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
    The Ca Constitution needs to be in line with the US Constitution. If it is not than it need to be rewritten. The CA Prop 8 fight will bring this to the SCOTUS and will see that same sex marriage will be made legal in every state. It could work for the best if CA decides it wants to go against the US Constitution.
    The California Constitution with a ban on gay marriage is in line with the US Constitution.

    The California Constitution without a ban on gay marriage is in line with the US Constitution.

    The US Constitution articulates neither a right to gay marriage nor a protection of that right. The matter is properly left to the states, and the State of California amended their constitution to bad gay marriage. The US Constitution, Amendment 10, gives them the power to do this.

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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldwaters View Post
    I have no doubt a Constitutional amendment banning gay marriage bans will eventually pass this way. The writing is on the wall...why fight it unitll then Celticlord?
    You should search the threads for my articulated position on the matter.

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