View Poll Results: Will the CA courts overturn Prop 8?

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  • Yes

    16 47.06%
  • No

    18 52.94%
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Thread: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

  1. #141
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldwaters View Post
    When I decided who I was going to vote for in 2008, I considered several social issues, gay marriage, abortion, stem cell research, and supreme court nominee likelyhoods. Gay marriage is the only social issue he's let me down on. I was unsure about Obama and the economy, but McCain continuing the Bush policies scared me more. So...there you have it. If you eliminate the noise from Conservatives and conservative media Obama's not in a terrible situation.
    Is there a single issue that -would- have caused you to not support The Obama?

    To me, if you feel gays are making a choice to be gay just to ignore your sensabilities, or they are in league with satan...you are anti gay. Furthermore...if you think a same sex orientation is unatural you are anti gay. JMO Sir.
    So, 'anti-gay' means to 'oppose the idea that homosexuality is natural and normal'?

  2. #142
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Is there a single issue that -would- have caused you to not support The Obama?
    Any three of the four social issues would cause my support for Obama to grow thin. But the alternative was McCain and that nitwitt Palin where it was four out of four against. At that point I would know more about what it felt like for a Republic to have McCain as a candidate...where you simply dislike your guy less than the other guy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    So, 'anti-gay' means to 'oppose the idea that homosexuality is natural and normal'?
    Eliminate the word normal and I'll stand behind the quote. Normal is too subjective of a term.

  3. #143
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldwaters View Post
    Eliminate the word normal and I'll stand behind the quote. Normal is too subjective of a term.
    OK -- fair enough.
    I'm not sure how that equates to 'anti-gay', however.
    It does equate to 'anti-the-idea-that-homosexuality-is-natural' but not anti-gay.

  4. #144
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Except where it violates prior points of the constitution without overturning them.
    That is just a contradiction. It simply means the constitution now contradicts itself. It would be simply a silly situation where two parts of the constitution say two completely contradictory things. It is not for a court to decide which is the more important point, it is for the legislature and people to try and work out the contradiction. But presumably such a situation, minus judicial activism, is unlikely to occur if sensible amendments are made.

    A court should not decide on a rare situation like that but if it were to then it would make more sense that it did in line with the amendment as this is the later change of constitution meant to establish something new but in such a situation obviously having screwed up.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 05-26-09 at 11:32 PM.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  5. #145
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldwaters View Post
    The Prop 8 amendment violates Article 1, Section 1, of California's Constitution, which enumerates "inalienable rights" to, among other things, liberty, happiness and privacy.
    Meh. Its not about any of those things. No one can stop you from being happy. If you want to marry someone invite your family and friends to a sunny field and say the words and the deed is done like its been done for thousands of years. No one is stopping anyone.

    This is about its about 2 things
    Money and seeking the approval of other people.
    It is pretty difficult to get people to approve you taking their money in the form of state or federal taxes/tax breaks. Seeking the approval of others is a bad road to take anyway. Take Obama lessons I guess. Hes got it down.
    Last edited by akyron; 05-26-09 at 11:35 PM.
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  6. #146
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldwaters
    The Prop 8 amendment violates Article 1, Section 1, of California's Constitution, which enumerates "inalienable rights" to, among other things, liberty, happiness and privacy.
    Oh for God's sake.

    You might as well just get rid of the constitution, rule of law, legislature and hell even the executive and simply replace it with a liberal committee on public safety with those kinds of arguments.

    Exactly what the judiciary could not decide by that kind of logic is hard to see.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Apparently not!

  8. #148
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    I haven't read every post in this thread and I'm sure that there are several that are off topic. I would like to say though that the courts got it right. Be for or against gay marriage, the rule of law and our system of government was victorious today and as Americans we should be proud. California rarely gets it right, but with this and the recent propositions on the ballot being voted down, there appears to be hope.

    As I've stated before, gay marriage will be legal one day soon in every state. I don't agree with the Constitutional amendment banning gay marriage, but I do respect that the process was followed and it played out as it should have.
    Welfare (Food Stamps, WIC, etc...) are not entitlements. They are taxpayer funded handouts and shouldn't be called entitlements at all. Social Security and Veteran's benefits are 'Entitlements' because the people receiving them are entitled to them. They were earned and paid for by the recipients.

  9. #149
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    That is just a contradiction. It simply means the constitution now contradicts itself. It would be simply a silly situation where two parts of the constitution say two completely contradictory things.
    But, that's not the case here. The amendment, being an amendment, overrides anything already in the constitution that contradicts it, and so there can be no contradiction.

    Never mind that this was not the question before the court.

  10. #150
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    Re: Will CA do the right thing and overturn Prop 8?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    But, that's not the case here. The amendment, being an amendment, overrides anything already in the constitution that contradicts it, and so there can be no contradiction.

    Never mind that this was not the question before the court.
    That would make sense of course, otherwise what is the point in the amendment.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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