View Poll Results: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

Voters
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  • Marijuana

    67 81.71%
  • Cocaine

    36 43.90%
  • LSD

    38 46.34%
  • Meth

    30 36.59%
  • Prescription drugs

    33 40.24%
  • Psychedelic mushrooms

    44 53.66%
  • Ecstasy

    35 42.68%
  • Opium

    38 46.34%
  • other

    28 34.15%
  • None of the above

    14 17.07%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

  1. #251
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    The question does not ask if the federal government makes it illegal, but merely which should be legal.

    I'm all for allowing all 50 states to ban meth/allow it independently.
    I totally agree with that. According to the 10th it should have been up to the states in the first place. The only reason it wasn't is because of a warped and abusive interpretation of the interstate commerce clause.

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    As for what business is it of mine? The same business I have in not allowing an individual to possess radioactive material.
    Any idea how much radioactive material is in your TV and computer?

    I think you're over estimating the effects that someone else's drug use could have on you. Unless they actually commit a crime, it doesn't affect you at all.

  2. #252
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldwaters View Post
    What exactly will cause consumption of cocaine, meth, and opiates to increase if they are legalized? Everybody I used to know who did those drugs had an absolutely endless supply through thier connections. That stuff is pouring over the Mexican border.

    So if drug users can get as much as they want anytime, how is legalizing it going to make it more available? There is no such thing as even more completely available.
    Hey man, I hear ya. And what you're saying holds a LOT of truth, I cannot deny that.

    I wish I was smart enough to say it in the right way but I have only so much to work with here. In fact, truth be known, I type with 2 fingers.

    So, let me just say it from my heart. I got no sources, no links, so just take it for what it is. From me to you.

    I am not a prude by most folks standards. In fact, I got a pretty decent buzz on, right now, as I type this to you. I just toasted a chamber of hydro I put away about 4 or 5 days ago and, (albeit rather harsh on my throat,) I am TOTALLY ready for some Floyd, but I digress..... (I do tend to ramble. please forgive me.)

    I know all about the trip. Windowpane. 4 way. 8 way. Micro-dot. Paper. 25. Yada, yada, yada..

    I know what you can do boiling up some fresh picked 'shroom's on a Friday night ( although, what you CANNOT do is make them taste good, no matter what you try. .)

    I know how to hold the pipe up and roll it, while you just keep the torch/lighter just the right distance away. I also know that tunnel sound.

    I know what you can do with the filter of a cigarette butt and two pennies.

    I make the best hand rubbed hash (and even a pretty decent powder hash) as anybody I have ever ran across. I was good at splicing too.

    I know what it's like, three days later, when your palms are purple and the enamel on your teeth feels like it's just about ground off.

    I also know what it's like to touch your own lips and not feel them.

    I have almost probably puked more alcohol than I have ever held down. ( I had a hard time stopping. )

    I ain't comin' at ya like no O'Reilly/Limbaugh rightwing kind of idiot.

    I am coming from me to you.

    Drugs are bad.

    M'kay?
    Last edited by Captain America; 05-22-09 at 11:50 PM.

    It's GREAT to be me. --- "45% liberal/55% conservative"
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  3. #253
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by ronpaulvoter View Post
    Why don't you try to understand why the LP is so strong on legalizing drugs? It is NOT because they want to use or sell them. It IS because a free market is far superior than one run by government. We had that in 1900. Drug abuse was practically nonexistant. Ditto for drug CRIME.
    False.

    Drug abuse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    "In the early 1900s, the first edition of the American Psychiatric Association's Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders referred to both alcohol and drug abuse as part of Sociopathic Personality Disturbances, which were thought to be symptoms of deeper psychological disorders or moral weakness [5]. By the third edition, in the 1940s, drug abuse was grouped into 'substance abuse'.
    How you can claim that drug abuse was non-existent yet it was being recognized by psychiatrists in a large enough number of people to give it it's own little section in their book of what at the time they considered 'mental' illnesses is beyond me. Either you're being dishonest or they are. I'll say : You.

    As far as there not being any drug related crime. Address the fact that a free market on hard drugs would actually lead to more crime. Drug cartels won't let the government of any country cut in on their business and as it is they use the proceeds from their money to engage in gasp - more criminal activity. Like : prostitution(not the good kind - the human trafficking kind that takes place in Costa Rica and won't disappear because drugs are legalized), funding of militias like FARC and the gun related violence that already goes on between cartels.

    Personally, I would never want to use these drugs except for legitimate medical purposes. But I am FED UP with our prisons being horribly overcrowded with extremist laws against actions that have no legitimate victims, billions of taxes being wasted for drug "wars," and dangerous criminals being created because of it.
    Agreed. You're not helping by making false statements though. Seriously. You're like those pro-gun rights guys who aren't willing to admit that not everybody feels safe around them. You're not helping.
    Last edited by Hatuey; 05-23-09 at 12:12 AM.
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  4. #254
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    The free market argument has some merit, but it depends on the drug. Things like cocaine can't be produced domestically in large amounts without the cocoa plant, and I'm not sure if that plant can even grow in North America. Heroin requires large scale poppy fields... this is probably more doable. The plants like marijuana, mushrooms, and cacti would somewhat remove the market from the equation since anyone can grow them cheaply. Basically, given any drug, if legalization means that it can be produced more cheaply and effectively than the cartels, then domestic product will win out.

    The cartels would always win out over government taxation programs. They will simply undercut the government price. Legalization must not always accompany taxation if you want to challenge the crime element.

    This is the main problem with the legalization argument right now. Whether or not the drug market is legal, the government is hesitant to legalize because there is no clear path to a system that allows the government to be on top (mostly financially), yet let the public do what it wants.

  5. #255
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Yes, drugs are bad m'kay. I think everyone can agree that drug abuse is a serious problem that needs to be addressed. The only argument here is how to address it.

    Both sides want to minimize drug use, and I think everyone agrees that education and deglamorization are good strategies that do work. However, prohibitionists believe the criminal justice system is also a contributing factor toward keeping drug use to a minimum. And we're saying it's not. Not only is prohibition ineffective at minimizing drug use, but it has a lot of negative side effects as well. It's like punching yourself in the head because you have a headache - it solves nothing and just adds to the overall problem. Since prohibition is not contributing to the goal, and its side effects are intolerable, obviously it's not a viable strategy in this war and therefore it should be discarded. Other strategies that we actually know are effective (education, deglamorization) should be the focus instead.

    Imagine I'm going to change the oil in my car. I have a wratchet, a socket, and a chainsaw. If you tell me that the chainsaw won't help, and it will actually cause problems instead, does that mean you don't want me to change my oil? Of course not, it means that you know a chainsaw is the wrong tool for the job. So I'm saying prohibition is the wrong tool for the job, while education and deglamorization are the right tools.

  6. #256
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    The free market argument has some merit, but it depends on the drug. Things like cocaine can't be produced domestically in large amounts without the cocoa plant, and I'm not sure if that plant can even grow in North America. Heroin requires large scale poppy fields... this is probably more doable. The plants like marijuana, mushrooms, and cacti would somewhat remove the market from the equation since anyone can grow them cheaply. Basically, given any drug, if legalization means that it can be produced more cheaply and effectively than the cartels, then domestic product will win out.

    The cartels would always win out over government taxation programs. They will simply undercut the government price. Legalization must not always accompany taxation if you want to challenge the crime element.

    This is the main problem with the legalization argument right now. Whether or not the drug market is legal, the government is hesitant to legalize because there is no clear path to a system that allows the government to be on top (mostly financially), yet let the public do what it wants.
    What you are talking about just relates to the degree at which certain substances are taxed extra, by no means does what you are saying means that a switch from something being illegal to just being extra taxed will have simillar crime and gang problems as before the legalization.

    Look at tobacco and especially alcohol. There is a certain degree of underground trade because of the excess taxes, however it is no where near what there was under prohibition.


    The government is able to get most of both degrees of crime control and economic control (taxes) in relation to illegal substances today.

  7. #257
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    What you are talking about just relates to the degree at which certain substances are taxed extra, by no means does what you are saying means that a switch from something being illegal to just being extra taxed will have simillar crime and gang problems as before the legalization.
    It's not the degree of taxation, but the degree to which the government is prepared to compete with the drug cartels. You have to realize that the government would be introducing a free market approach to drugs and in order to keep them safe and effective there would need to be regulations. I'm usually against legalization for this very reason... I do not trust government and corporations to regulate the product, and they will, of course, want to.

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    Look at tobacco and especially alcohol. There is a certain degree of underground trade because of the excess taxes, however it is no where near what there was under prohibition.
    Tobacco and alcohol are different because they have historical precedent. People have been using them for thousands of years openly, so trying to take that away makes no sense as it will not curb demand whatsoever. It's why the black market had such an easy time taking over the trade.

    Other narcotics have been outlawed long enough now that they are not socially acceptable anymore. Added to that, they have been outlawed long enough to allow for a well established underground to control supply and demand. In order to curb the crime of the hard drugs, the government would have to become (or subsidize) a supplier that outdoes all the others. Again, I don't trust government to do this or corporate powers.

    I'm in favor of decriminalizing hard drugs but not legalizing them because it will transfer the ability to abuse users from drug dealers and cartels to government and corporate power.

    Quote Originally Posted by nerv14 View Post
    The government is able to get most of both degrees of crime control and economic control (taxes) in relation to illegal substances today.
    For example?

  8. #258
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    The question does not ask if the federal government makes it illegal, but merely which should be legal.
    And the correct answer is the federal government has ZERO authority to regulate chemical substances.

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    I'm all for allowing all 50 states to ban meth/allow it independently.
    So, therefore, you agree that the federal government has ZERO authority to regulate chemical substances, otherwise you would not be arguing that it's a matter for the Tenth Amendment.

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    As for what business is it of mine? The same business I have in not allowing an individual to possess radioactive material.
    So your fear of meth is that it the finished product irradiates the local surroundings?

    You are aware that almost every home in America contains detectable amounts of radioactive substances, including deadly uranium and radium, not to forget the ubiquitous Potatssium-40 and every other naturally occuring unstable isotope simply found in the dirt,....

  9. #259
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    All of Em
    ~Following My Own Flow~

  10. #260
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    Re: Which drugs should be legalized for recreational use?

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post

    Drugs are bad.

    M'kay?
    I kind of deciphered the same thing during 20 years of heavy drug use and addiction, 13 years of clean sobriety, and 7 years as a substance abuse counselor at a drug/alchohol rehab facility. Believe it or not, I'm not trying to offer this information to insinuate any greater grasp of the subject. I just want you to know that I'm not a proponent of drug use. I'm simply aware of it's permanence. It's been part of human life for over 3000 years. Right now the forcing underground of drugs makes them infinitly more dangerous.

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