View Poll Results: Have you ever felt that you don't belong in your country?

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  • Yes

    16 34.78%
  • No

    27 58.70%
  • Other

    3 6.52%
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Thread: Do You Belong Here?

  1. #61
    Dorset Patriot
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    IMO nationalism in the patriotic sense is dangerous and ignorant.
    I think is complex. I don't liberal extreme universal is a good replacement. I don't feel replacing one abstraction with an even greater one is going to help. I sure as hell am not European patriot.

    I think nationalism or at least the nation state and national identity can be a good thing if it is built on integrated, and yes stronger, local and regional patriotism and takes in room for both the small-scale associations that make up a nation and the necessary very mild bit of universalism to dilute effects of any massively too strong particularism.

    I do have my doubts so about such abstract and massive identities as India, China and the US.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  2. #62
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Not in my country, per se, but I was born and raised in the mountains and I've never felt that I belonged in the desert or anywhere that's flat.
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  3. #63
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    sure I do....


    Rev, I wish I could thank you twice for bringing Johnny Cash into this, and thereby raising the cultural sophistication of the forum several notches.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
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    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

  4. #64
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    Personally I've always wondered how you could have such intense patriotism for an entity the size of the US. It seems to me you don't know most of the places or people, sure you can have warm feelings towards the country but patriotism, I think that should start and be strongest in ones locale and region.

    Even my English patriotism is far less than that towards Wessex or Dorset.

    As Burke said: To love the little platoon we belong to in society, is the first principle (the germ as it were) of public affections.
    To love all of nature is easier for you to comprehend, maybe?

    OBL 11/24/02

  5. #65
    Stigmatized! End R Word! Kali's Avatar
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    YEs. Some days I do not think I belong on this Earth:-O

  6. #66
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    It makes more sense to me to strive to show love and compassion to all human beings, regardless if they are your countrymen or not. If America were split down the center today into two countries, that arbitrary border, over time, would also divide affections. The border is relatively meaningless in terms of one's ability to treat others as they would want to be treated.

  7. #67
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad View Post
    To love all of nature is easier for you to comprehend, maybe?
    Huh?
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  8. #68
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    It makes more sense to me to strive to show love and compassion to all human beings, regardless if they are your countrymen or not. If America were split down the center today into two countries, that arbitrary border, over time, would also divide affections. The border is relatively meaningless in terms of one's ability to treat others as they would want to be treated.
    You are right and you are wrong. To have intense patriotism for a massive entity makes little sense to me because you know so little of it through your everyday experiences, it seems like abtractionism. But that goes doubly so for humanity as a whole, I certainly think that one should have that mininum of respect and love for his fellow man but it is to those small-scale associtions, those little platoons that I feel one shoul dhave the greatest loyalty too, it is these that form of much of the individuals personality, meaning, order and freedom.

    I do not trust either those nationalists who put the nation before all other associations and those universalists who try and put humanity before all.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    You are right and you are wrong. To have intense patriotism for a massive entity makes little sense to me because you know so little of it through your everyday experiences, it seems like abtractionism. But that goes doubly so for humanity as a whole, I certainly think that one should have that mininum of respect and love for his fellow man but it is to those small-scale associtions, those little platoons that I feel one shoul dhave the greatest loyalty too, it is these that form of much of the individuals personality, meaning, order and freedom.

    I do not trust either those nationalists who put the nation before all other associations and those universalists who try and put humanity before all.
    Creating a dichotomy based on the micro and the macro and then deciding which you care for more is unnecessary in my eyes. I have been all over the world so I see it all as one entity. Maybe if I were born hundreds of years ago and never travelled outside of my community and knew nothing about the outside world, I would have more loyalty to my locale.

  10. #70
    Dorset Patriot
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    Re: Do You Belong Here?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    Creating a dichotomy based on the micro and the macro and then deciding which you care for more is unnecessary in my eyes. I have been all over the world so I see it all as one entity. Maybe if I were born hundreds of years ago and never travelled outside of my community and knew nothing about the outside world, I would have more loyalty to my locale.
    All that means is you know a little of many places, rather than a great deal about a few, not a good thing in my book. It seems superficial to me. We are still humans with limited faculties, we cannot know and experience everyday detailed associations and areas beyond the quite small. The dichotomy still exists and it seems a lot surer footing against atomism, abstractionism and a better platform for a realistic, free and ordered society if one identifies far more strongly with the little platoons rather than having or trying to have intense patriotism for large areas or humanity, entities we know very little about in our everyday experiences.

    As George Canning said about Thomas Paine:

    A citizen of the world alone, a friend of every country but his own.

    I make no bones about preferring my family by far to random people from the other side of the world and preferring my community to that of a far-flung city and preferring my region to one in China.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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