View Poll Results: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Family Member?

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  • Yes

    61 80.26%
  • No

    15 19.74%
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Thread: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

  1. #411
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    Did you mean disregarded? Back atcha, buddy!
    Actually I meant discarded. I can't speel for ****.


    Edit: The reason "disregarded" doesn't make sense is that ti would imply that your argument was even worthy of consideration. It wasn't. It deserved to be cast aside as nonsense because you are clearly an intellectually dishonest hyperpartisan hack.

    P.S. Glinda is a good name, but I would say that you are more reminiscent of another character from the Wizard of Oz.

    "I would while away the hours, conversin' with the flowers..."


    At the very least, it would match up with your penchant for straw man arguments.
    Last edited by Tucker Case; 05-13-09 at 09:45 PM.

  2. #412
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Actually I meant discarded. I can't speel for ****.


    Edit: The reason "disregarded" doesn't make sense is that ti would imply that your argument was even worthy of consideration. It wasn't. It deserved to be cast aside as nonsense because you are clearly an intellectually dishonest hyperpartisan hack.

    P.S. Glinda is a good name, but I would say that you are more reminiscent of another character from the Wizard of Oz.

    "I would while away the hours, conversin' with the flowers..."


    At the very least, it would match up with your penchant for straw man arguments.
    Moderator's Warning:
    Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?Quit the personal attacks and debate the topic not the poster. Thanks.

  3. #413
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?



    By the way, for anyone wondering, another shining example of me reporting my own posts when I cross the line.

  4. #414
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Your opinion has been noted and subsequently disguarded as it is purely irrational nonsense.
    Curious commentary. I think it's been pretty well established that torture rarely yields viable intelligence, never in a timely fashion, and is morally reprehensible not to mention against the law and values of the civilized world in general. So what is it that makes you come down on this person with such a judgment?

  5. #415
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I wouldn't blink if I were in a situation of "this guy has information that will save ANYONE's life and I was the only one able to act".

    I'd grab a few tools from my tool box and he'd either tell, or spend the rest of his life a miserable wreck.

    I'd start with a hammer, ballpeen type. Work on those fingers. That fails, I'd take a lamp, cut the cord and split the wires, then plug in the end... and brush him gently a few times.

    Failing that.. I'd get a spoon, and feed him an eyeball.

    Maybe his nuts as well.

    And I wouldn't feel guilty about it. AT ALL.
    Do you masturbate when you fantasize like that? You bullies really are a sick lot. I especially like the part about what a wreck his life would be if he didn't tell you what you want to know. That statement says all you need to know about the bully's mindset, taking pleasure in the suffering of others.

  6. #416
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slippery Slope View Post
    Curious commentary. I think it's been pretty well established that torture rarely yields viable intelligence, never in a timely fashion, and is morally reprehensible not to mention against the law and values of the civilized world in general.
    The guy (the most respected interrogator in the FBI!) said that he was getting very valuable intel from Abu. You know, stuff like who the mastermind of 9/11 was and who was the 20th hijacker. Stuff like that.

    Then Cheney's CIA torture squad came in and insisted on torturing him. He immediately clammed up! When they went back to conventional interrogation guess what? He started talking. They resumed waterboarding and again he stopped talking.

    What part of this do you right wingers not understand?
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

  7. #417
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slippery Slope View Post
    Curious commentary. I think it's been pretty well established that torture rarely yields viable intelligence, never in a timely fashion, and is morally reprehensible not to mention against the law and values of the civilized world in general. So what is it that makes you come down on this person with such a judgment?
    I like to pretend to miss little things like "...IMO, seems rather craven and cowardly" when engaging in dishonest debate tactics, too.

    IMO = In my opinion.

    That opinion, which was personal attack, was the one discarded as irrational nonsense. Not the opinion that torture is always immoral.

    She portrayed, as many do, things as though her opinions on the morality of torture as undeniable "facts". They aren't "facts" at all. They are mere opinions. But I don't discard those opinions as irrational nonsense. It is true that I may discard the processes taken to reach the opinion as illogical, that would be entirely dependent upon the methods employed by teh holder of the opinion.

    Are the premises valid, or are they based on more opinion? Is there validity to the argument, or does it use logical fallacies, etc. etc

    One thing I will always argue against is anyone who claims that their moral views are undeniable fact. That statement is always irrational nonsense. Since the veracity of one's "morality" is totally unprovable, making any claims that one's morality is more "true" than another's is never anything more than an opinion statement.

    I discard all arguments that reach that conclusion as illogical nonsense, but only because they are illogical nonsense.

  8. #418
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    The guy (the most respected interrogator in the FBI!) said that he was getting very valuable intel from Abu. You know, stuff like who the mastermind of 9/11 was and who was the 20th hijacker. Stuff like that.

    Then Cheney's CIA torture squad came in and insisted on torturing him. He immediately clammed up! When they went back to conventional interrogation guess what? He started talking. They resumed waterboarding and again he stopped talking.

    What part of this do you right wingers not understand?
    What exactly does this have to do with the hypothetical?

  9. #419
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    The guy (the most respected interrogator in the FBI!) said that he was getting very valuable intel from Abu. You know, stuff like who the mastermind of 9/11 was and who was the 20th hijacker. Stuff like that.

    Then Cheney's CIA torture squad came in and insisted on torturing him. He immediately clammed up! When they went back to conventional interrogation guess what? He started talking. They resumed waterboarding and again he stopped talking.

    What part of this do you right wingers not understand?
    I was going to point this out to our pro-torture friends -thanks for bringing it into the discussion.

    What say you, pro-torture people?

  10. #420
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Two points:

    1. How have I damaged any arguments that I have made in this thread? Cops have to allow a detainee Miranda rights. They can't torture the info out of them because they are confined by the laws and it must be assumed that they won't be willing to break them in order to save my family.
    Yeah, what miranda right prevents a cop from using torture? Having a lawyer present during questioning? OK so the torture begins when the lawyer gets there. Oh, something about coerced confessions? Why wouldn't we just do away with that since torture works so well? If we can legalize torture surely we can change the miranda law to accommodate such an effective means of getting the truth... If waterboarding is so effective the all law enforcement agencies should go for that first, right?

    Judge: How do you plead?
    defendant: not guilty
    Judge: The officer says you were speeding and you deny it so court will recess for 2 hours while we get to the truth... Bailiff, take the defendant to the torture chamber.

    I on the other hand, would risk everything to save my family. I'd willfully break any law in order to do so.
    What was it you said in another post? Oh yeah, irrational nonsense.

    "Fear is the foundation of most governments; but it is so sordid and brutal a passion, and renders men in whose breasts it predominates so stupid and miserable, that Americans will not be likely to approve of any political institution which is founded on it."

    2. I believe that a proscription on police and all government officials form engaging in torture is correct. I support the laws that prevent police officers from using torture. The point I'm making is that in the given hypothetical I would utilize torture. Personally. As in a free citizen, not associated with the government, breaking the laws of the nation in order to achieve a goal.
    This is a contradictory statement. First off, what prevents a cop from saying the same thing as a private citizen? 2nd, if it's good enough for you, why not everyone? 3rd, if you think it would work then why keep the government/law enforcement from using an effectual tool?

    I would also willingly accept any and all legal ramifications that would stem from that action. Since I have never argued for the "legalization" of torture, I haven't done anything that contradicts my position in any way shape or form.
    Oh, I see. So you'd break the law and use torture but you don't think it should be lawful. Why not if it works?

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