View Poll Results: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Family Member?

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  • Yes

    61 80.26%
  • No

    15 19.74%
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Thread: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

  1. #401
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    The thing is, if I were in the situation of having the bad guy in my custody, and I had to break his knee cap to save YOUR life, I'd do it.
    I'd rather you didn't. I'm not particularly keen on thugs trying to justify their brutality in my name.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Reverse the situation, my kids would go to my funeral. And you consider yourself morally better then I am?
    I'm afraid this makes no sense to me. Why would your kids going to your funeral have any bearing on my unbreakable morals?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I think you're a coward, and people like you scare me.
    HAAA! A "coward" scares you? That's pretty funny. Thanks for the laugh! Life must be really terrifying for you, my friend.

  2. #402
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    I'd rather you didn't. I'm not particularly keen on thugs trying to justify their brutality in my name.
    Obviously life has little value you to you. It means a lot to me.


    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    I'm afraid this makes no sense to me. Why would your kids going to your funeral have any bearing on my unbreakable morals?
    It means your morals are FUBAR. You have no morals, you have an inability to face reality and couch that in guilt and fear and claim it's "morally right to let others die rather then hurt someone." That's beyond fooked up.

    My right to life > another persons right to harm or end my life.

    If someone broke into my home, I'd shoot them. Wouldn't even blink. Somehow I think you couldn't defend yourself or your family, might hurt the bad guys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    HAAA! A "coward" scares you? That's pretty funny. Thanks for the laugh! Life must be really terrifying for you, my friend.
    I'm not SCARED of you, personally, I'm scared of people like you (I.E. liberals) that are in positions of power... which sadly they are right now... having the responsibility of keeping me and my country safe.

    But that point eludes you... obviously.
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  3. #403
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    Face it, guy. You shot yourself in your own foot by stating that only a fool would admit anything to their captors.
    I said police. I was quite clear in that. I never used the term "captors". Why are you lying about what I said?

    Oh and please don't alter my quotes to "blah blah blah" in the future. If you can't make a salient point, and must resort to lies, don't bother responding to me.


    Hello? WE as a nation are "confined by the laws" to which we have signed our name. Torture is prohibited under US law and under international law. That includes our government, our police force, and you as an individual.
    Yes. And I would violate any law for the right reasons. Would you violate a law for a good reason?


    So you'll do it for them? What happened to being "confined by the laws" we as a nation have agreed to uphold?
    I didn't make the laws. I agreed to nothing. I'm not doing it for them [the police/governemnt], I'm doing it for my family's lives in the given hypothetical.



    Self defense is one thing; tying someone up and beating them for any reason is against the law.
    So? I'd break the law to save my family.



    I guess you're much more violent than I am, and put much less value on the rule of law than I do.
    I'm saying I value the lives of my family above all else, including the laws of our country, and the country itself.



    Ah. Good. If you ever tried doing what you've claimed you're more than willing to do, you'd be tried, convicted, and executed. As you should be.
    So be it. If my family is safe I would be going to my death a happy man. (aLthough I don;t think torture is a capital crime anywhere in this coutnry)


    You're attempting to argue both sides of the question: I'll do what I want/feel I must, up to and including torture, but our nation must never allow torture under any circumstances.
    I'm not arguing both sides of the question. I'm actually not adding a level to the hypothetical that doesn't exist.

    Also, you seem to be purposely excluding my prepositional phrase "to save my family" in my comments. More dishonesty from you.

    How about picking one side and sticking with it?
    I have. Your inability to comprehend my point does not negate it.

  4. #404
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    I would violate any law for the right reasons. Would you violate a law for a good reason?
    No. There are no good reasons to violate the law; there are merely convenient ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Also, you seem to be purposely excluding my prepositional phrase "to save my family" in my comments.
    Torture is not justified in ANY case. Using your family in an attempt to justify breaking national and international law is irrelevant, and, IMO, seems rather craven and cowardly.
    Last edited by Glinda; 05-13-09 at 04:39 PM.

  5. #405
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    No. There are no good reasons to violate the law; there are merely convenient ones.
    Epic fail. You lose. End of story. Worst argument ever.

  6. #406
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    No. There are no good reasons to violate the law; there are merely convenient ones.
    So if you saw someone about to be hit by a car, you wouldn't jaywalk in order to save their life?

    Seems like a stupid argument to me.



    Torture is not justified in ANY case. Using your family in an attempt to justify breaking national and international law is irrelevant, and, IMO, seems rather craven and cowardly.
    Your opinion has been noted and subsequently disguarded as it is purely irrational nonsense.

  7. #407
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Your opinion has been noted and subsequently disguarded as it is purely irrational nonsense.
    Did you mean disregarded? Back atcha, buddy!

  8. #408
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    No. There are no good reasons to violate the law; there are merely convenient ones.
    By your logic, Blacks would still be at the back of the bus then. Good thing Rosa Parks had better moral fiber then you.
    C.T.L.W. You figure it out
    My Endo doc went over my blood work. "I see your estrogen level is now at 315, do you feel like you have too much Estrogen now?"
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  9. #409
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    I'm uninterested in the progression of this dialogue. I knew from the very beginning you would not, under any circumstances, cede to me one inch, no matter how thoroughly and meticulously I deconstructed my argument. Your obsession with this hypothetical and your need to undermine it is apparent, for it represents a fatal flaw in your argument about maintaining "principle", "honor", and "morality".
    I don't agree with you, even when you have made an argument. Oh **** how evil I am.

    It doesn't represent a fatal flaw because it doesn't represent anything much.

    You know that despite its implausible nature there is only but a few degrees of separation between my hypothetical and the justifications for water-boarding; that is why you continually seek to undermine its applicability; not because you're genuinely incapable of seeing its worth but because it undermines your position. This has been your modus operandi from the onset of the discussion and I will not be held hostage by your desire to retain leverage in this debate.
    Ahh, now you are trying to say it is close to the discussion of waterboarding but you are not showing how. I don't see its worth and you have not even attempted to show how it could be applied to a real-life complex situations including the debate on waterboarding. This is an extremely unsatisfactory argument on your part and it is going to take more than an assertion about degrees of separation for you to have an argument you can use in the waterboarding debate taken from this scenario.

    [
    I will not discuss this issue with you any further because nothing worthwhile can come of it; neither of us will be convinced of the other's position. This thread has become terribly uninteresting and I'd like to return to the topic at hand.
    And I'll jusy reiterate my request that you show exactly how this scenario and its outcome can be applied to real-life, complex situations.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  10. #410
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    I wouldn't blink if I were in a situation of "this guy has information that will save ANYONE's life and I was the only one able to act".

    I'd grab a few tools from my tool box and he'd either tell, or spend the rest of his life a miserable wreck.

    I'd start with a hammer, ballpeen type. Work on those fingers. That fails, I'd take a lamp, cut the cord and split the wires, then plug in the end... and brush him gently a few times.

    Failing that.. I'd get a spoon, and feed him an eyeball.

    Maybe his nuts as well.

    And I wouldn't feel guilty about it. AT ALL.
    Does play talking like that make this little weather man feel like a real man?
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

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