View Poll Results: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Family Member?

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  • Yes

    61 80.26%
  • No

    15 19.74%
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Thread: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

  1. #291
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    Sure. Because your hypothetical is lame. Ignorant.
    These are not substantive criticisms.

    Not possible in the real world.
    1. It's a hypothetical, therefore it need not be possible.

    2. Improbable is not the same thing as impossible.

    Tell you what. You explain how you KNOW this person has information that no one else has.
    Alright, I witnessed this man kidnap my family.

    THEN explain why, if you're so good at reading minds, you need to torture the person at all.
    Mind-reading is unnecessary. I saw him kidnap my family, therefore I KNOW he has information regarding their whereabouts. Anyway, all of this is nothing more than an irrelevant tangent, meant to avoid the issue. You'll most likely continue trying to distort my hypothetical, muddying the waters with irrelevancies and convoluted modifications. Can't say I'm surprised though, for some people this issue isn't about logic, it's about politics and emotion.

  2. #292
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightdemon View Post
    When my wife tells me the same thing, I call her a tease.
    But seriously, I was looking forward to part 2.
    Perhaps I will reconsider. I'm on summer right now so my time spent in the forum will be considerably less than usual.

  3. #293
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Anyway, all of this is nothing more than an irrelevant tangent, meant to avoid the issue. You'll most likely continue trying to distort my hypothetical, muddying the waters with irrelevancies and convoluted modifications. Can't say I'm surprised though, for some people this issue isn't about logic, it's about politics and emotion.
    Sorry. Your hypothetical is completely illogical. And impossible. Maybe you should have thought out your hypothetical to its logical conclusion using reality as a guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Mind-reading is unnecessary. I saw him kidnap my family, therefore I KNOW he has information regarding their whereabouts. Anyway, all of this is nothing more than an irrelevant tangent, meant to avoid the issue.
    Oh. So now you're changing/adding to your hypothetical to suit your argument and to better fit your "gotcha" scenario. Noted.

    My response: torture is NEVER ACCEPTABLE. Not even in your twisted little "24" world. Someone else already gave you my answer:

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    Ah yes, the ubiquitous "ticking time bomb" argument that actually never happens in the real world. You think if we answer "yes" to one of these scenarios then the use of torture is warranted, right? Wrong. Torture has been legislated to be illegal. There are no exceptions.
    Not only that, it's immoral. Ask your gawd to explain it to you.
    Last edited by Glinda; 05-10-09 at 02:18 PM.

  4. #294
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    Sorry. Your hypothetical is completely illogical. And impossible. Maybe you should have thought out your hypothetical to its logical conclusion using reality as a guide.
    I cannot debate someone who does not understand the nature of a hypothetical or why it needn't be possible in order to have logical and moral value.

    Oh. So now you're changing/adding to your hypothetical to suit your argument and to better fit your "gotcha" scenario. Noted.
    Are you serious? YOU demanded that I clarify my hypothetical and I acquiesced. You're obviously incapable of having an honest dialogue with me. You're just here to rant and rave about "TORTURE".

    My response: torture is NEVER ACCEPTABLE. Not even in your twisted little "24" world. Someone else already gave you my answer:
    This absolutist statement merely confirms your unwillingness to subject your suppositions to logical and moral scrutiny. You're not here to debate, you're here to distort the issue with rants and emotional arguments.

  5. #295
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    This absolutist statement merely confirms your unwillingness to subject your suppositions to logical and moral scrutiny.
    How so? Do you suppose that because I abhor and oppose torture for ANY reason that I haven't pondered the logical and moral implications of said behavior? There you go again, pretending you can read minds.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    You're not here to debate, you're here to distort the issue with rants and emotional arguments.
    And you started this disingenuous discussion as a "gotcha." Tough luck, pal. You didn't "get me." I stand firmly by my ethical, honorable, non-blood-lust principles and morals. As an avowed pro-torture advocate, can you say the same?

  6. #296
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    How so? Do you suppose that because I abhor and oppose torture for ANY reason that I haven't pondered the logical and moral implications of said behavior? There you go again, pretending you can read minds.

    Then perhaps you could actually expand upon this instead of merely citing your position as axiomatic.

    And you started this disingenuous discussion as a "gotcha." Tough luck, pal. You didn't "get me."
    Alas! Foiled again! Your morality is only exceeded by your perceptiveness.

    I stand firmly by my ethical, honorable, non-blood-lust principles and morals. As an avowed pro-torture advocate, can you say the same?
    Yes, I most certainly can.

  7. #297
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    I'm not particularly interested in your personal details. I figured as long as you were going to ask me a series of irrelevant questions I'd follow suite.
    Well I have one more for you which is perhaps more relevant. When you were a Marine where did you serve?
    “We must picture hell as a state where everyone is perpetually concerned about his own dignity and advancement, where everyone has a grievance, and where everyone lives with the deadly serious passions of envy, self-importance, and resentment.”
    ― C.S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters

  8. #298
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Saboteur View Post
    Well I have one more for you which is perhaps more relevant. When you were a Marine where did you serve?
    I'm not sure how this is relevant.

  9. #299
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Your daughter is missing. This man was caught with her clothing in his possession. He's an arrogant *** and says he buried her alive, she has a few hours of air left and then she dies. He refuses to say where she is.
    I may be willing to do allot of things I don't want my country doing as a matter of state policy. (I may want to listen in to my teenage daughter's phone calls....but I don;'t want the FBI doing it)

    Or...

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Mohammad Ben Misbehavin' is a known terrorist, currently in custody. Intel says he belongs to a group known as Jihad R Us. Intel says your daughter has been kidnapped by Jihad R Us. Mohammad Ben Misbehavin' is believed to have complete knowlege of JRU's safehouses and communications methods. He refuses to talk.

    There ya go. Now answer the question, please.

    G.
    "Known Terrorist"?.....What the hell does that mean? (sounds like a "Suspected Terrorist" to me)

    "Intel says"...Intel is often wrong.

    "is believed to have complete knowlege "......Believed to have????


    Be honest...You have no facts....you just want to hurt these guys for your own pleasure right? (In that case, have J, Bybee write a memo saying it's OK....That's all Bush did)

  10. #300
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    Re: Would You Utilize Torture to Save a Life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    I'm not sure how this is relevant.
    You said that terrorists aren't people so I figure you were in Afghanistan because if you were in Iraq you were probably fighting people involved in different political factions for control of neighborhoods/towns, aka insurgents, not terrorists. Though I suppose some of them could have been.
    “We must picture hell as a state where everyone is perpetually concerned about his own dignity and advancement, where everyone has a grievance, and where everyone lives with the deadly serious passions of envy, self-importance, and resentment.”
    ― C.S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters

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