View Poll Results: Did we evolve from Apes?

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  • Yes, we evolved from Apes.

    71 53.38%
  • No, we have not evolved in any shape or form, we are the same biological beings we have always been.

    26 19.55%
  • Yes, we did evolve, but i do not think we evolved from Apes.

    36 27.07%
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Thread: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

  1. #131
    Educator Grateful Heart's Avatar
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Grateful Heart, your error is that you are transposing gravity and gravitation. Gravitation can be measured, gravity cannot. Flip around the terms "gravity" and gravitation in your last post and it'll be correct.
    Gravitation is a universal property represented by the gravitational constant. That constant, G, is not a force, but is used to determine the force, or gravity, between two objects with mass. That force is sometimes referred to as the 'gravitational force'. But that is not synonymous with 'gravitation.'



    To repeat the distinction:

    "Gravitation" is a general term describing the phenomenon by which bodies with mass are attracted to one another, while "gravity" refers specifically to the net force exerted by the Earth on objects in its vicinity as well as by other factors, such as the Earth's rotation.
    [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravity"]Gravity[/ame]
    Last edited by Grateful Heart; 04-20-09 at 04:55 PM.

  2. #132
    Matthew 16:3

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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grateful Heart View Post
    Gravitation is a universal property represented by the gravitational constant. That constant, G, is not a force, but is used to determine the force, or gravity, between two objects with mass. That force is sometimes referred to as the 'gravitational force'. But that is not synonymous with 'gravitation.'



    To repeat the distinction:

    Gravity
    As you pointed out, G is the gravitational constant. It is a measure of the gravitational attraction between two bodies of mass.

    That gravitational attraction is THEORIZED to be caused by the force of gravity.

    It may indeed have another cause than what has currently been theorized.

    I'm not saying gravity doesn't exist, I'm saying it may not exist. The same cannot be said regarding gravitation. It most definitely, 100%, without a doubt, exists.

  3. #133
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    If the sole reasoning behind the dynamics is magic, I'd probably look for an alternative explanation.
    Why would you doubt it?

  4. #134
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    How has science disproven creation/ID?
    Doesn't have to do so until they bother to make Creationism/ID a properly formatted scientific theory. Right now it's just bunk, and religious bunk, at that.

  5. #135
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    So... if the argument were 'gravity were caused by God', you'd doubt it?
    One would have to prove the existence of god, then.

    Good luck with that.

  6. #136
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Personally, I don't thing ID is legitimate science simply because it answers the "why" question.
    No, it doesn't answer the "why" question at all.

    Why does the vagus nerve swoop and droop as it does? The intelligent design would be to route the thing on the most direct route, not send it looping down into the chest from the brain to come back up to the throat.

    Evolution answers the "why" of that easily enough. The vagus nerve loops down and about because that's what it does in fish, and our remote vertebrate ancestors were fish, and that's a holdover from that time.

    Now, no intelligent designer is going to build all the workarounds we see in animals and ourselves, but blind evolution, working solely with what's available at the present moment, is going to wind up doing just that.

  7. #137
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Why would you doubt it?
    Ok, here's the thing. It's not that I would doubt or accept it. Well personally, I'm atheist so I wouldn't accept answers which rely on gods. Regardless of that, it's not about doubt or acceptance. It's about how you're forming a scientific theory and trying to figure out and explain the dynamics of how something came to be as we observe it. "God did it" may be fine to many, but in the scientific sense when you're talking of theories and proof, it has nothing. Not only does it rely on an immeasurable (gods), but it's fundamentally untestable. To prove god did it, you must prove god. And even it all that's true. God exists and he made everything. Stating that god did it, doesn't give any insight into the actual dynamics involved. Science searches for an understanding, how things work fundamentally. Science doesn't use "god did it" as answer because even if it were true it doesn't ultimately help anything. I would personally reject the explanation based on magic because I would ultimately find the explanation useless. On the whole is it really doubt/acceptance or is it a satisfactory answer sort of thing? I could maybe got the satisfactory answer path. You can accept maybe ID, but maybe still not like it as an answer as it does nothing to answer it.

    I don't know, I don't think I'm doing a good job clarifying my position. ID/Creationism is definitely rejected out of the science classroom, as well it should be as they are not scientific theories. Anything which relies on gods as ultimate solution is not a theory of science; it's a theory of theology. Why is ID doubted and gravity accepted? I think it's because it's a lot harder to doubt gravity as it's a measurable affect in our daily lives; gods are not. Even without knowing the full dynamics of gravity, people know gravity exists because even without knowing force transmitters, and negative mass and things of that nature; people experience gravity in a very real and measurable sense everyday and is confirmed by more than just our personal experiences but even in our technology like satellites and such. Well measured vs. immeasurable, it's a lot easier for people to accept the measured values before the immeasurable ones.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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  8. #138
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Doesn't have to do so until they bother to make Creationism/ID a properly formatted scientific theory. Right now it's just bunk, and religious bunk, at that.
    The posting I responsed to was:

    Wherever science disproves the myths of religion there will be speculation. It is the only reason evolution is cast in doubt and only in the eyes of the faithful.
    And so I asked:
    How has science disproven creation/ID?

  9. #139
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    And so I asked:
    How has science disproven creation/ID?
    Science can not and will not prove/disprove Creation/ID. Science can not and will not prove/disprove gods. If you can't or refuse to do that step, you can not disprove or prove anything which relies on gods as part of the answer.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #140
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    Re: Evolution: Did we really evolve from Apes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    The posting I responsed to was:



    And so I asked:
    How has science disproven creation/ID?
    And I said that science isn't required to disprove the ignorant ramblings of unscientific religious groups. If they ever get their religious dogma into the form of a proper theory, then scientists might be required to disprove them, which as has been shown won't be difficult, and then what will the cults do? They'll go back to their ignorant ramblings.

    Then I pointed out that the "design" of your basic human animal leaves a lot to be desired before anyone can call the designer "intelligent". Creationism, of course, is arrant nonsense.

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