View Poll Results: Should the right to bear children be regulated?

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  • Yes to help keep the poulation down so hunting lands don't get overcrowded!

    4 6.78%
  • Yes for other reasons

    15 25.42%
  • No this is dumb

    31 52.54%
  • Hmmm maybe

    9 15.25%
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Thread: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

  1. #81
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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    You have got these backwards. Communism is the ideal classless and stateless society; Socialism is government control of industry in preparation for a transition to Communism.
    Oops! I had the concepts in my mind but mixed up the terms. Thanks for the correction.

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    Fascism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. One can argue whether or not China qualifies as Fascist, but there's certainly more to the matter than totalitarianism, as any of the failed Soviet states can warrant.
    [/quote]

    You're right, it's arguable. I personally don't think China qualifies as fascist even though it definitely has some totalitarian elements.

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    fyi Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    The best way to control child bearing without violating personal rights is to ensure that childbearing requires the RESPONSIBILITY of the parents to care for them, NOT use the government to do it.

    NOBODY should be mandated to care for other people's children.

    ELIMINATE the welfare programs that encourage irresponsible childbearing.

  3. #83
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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by ronpaulvoter View Post
    The best way to control child bearing without violating personal rights is to ensure that childbearing requires the RESPONSIBILITY of the parents to care for them, NOT use the government to do it.

    NOBODY should be mandated to care for other people's children.

    ELIMINATE the welfare programs that encourage irresponsible childbearing.
    so you have no qualms about punishing the innocents born to irresponsible people????

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    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

  4. #84
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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeJayH View Post
    so you have no qualms about punishing the innocents born to irresponsible people????
    I have greater qualms about punishing the innocent parents wrongly attacked as irresponsible.

    I also have greater confidence in the average adult of the species to adequately parent a child--far greater confidence in said average adult than in the average government bureaucracy.

    If I have to err, I choose to err on the side of the parent, on the side of parents rights, and on the side of individual liberty to raise children by whatever guidelines one finds appropriate. As long as a child receives an education, is fed properly, is clothed when out in public, and is not constantly bruised, battered, or otherwise explicitly abused (i.e., told he/she is worthless, et cetera), I choose to trust the parent's judgment where the child is concerned.

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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    I have greater qualms about punishing the innocent parents wrongly attacked as irresponsible.

    I also have greater confidence in the average adult of the species to adequately parent a child--far greater confidence in said average adult than in the average government bureaucracy.

    If I have to err, I choose to err on the side of the parent, on the side of parents rights, and on the side of individual liberty to raise children by whatever guidelines one finds appropriate. As long as a child receives an education, is fed properly, is clothed when out in public, and is not constantly bruised, battered, or otherwise explicitly abused (i.e., told he/she is worthless, et cetera), I choose to trust the parent's judgment where the child is concerned.
    well "world needs plenty of Bahtenduhs"

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    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

  6. #86
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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    I believe this is partially true, but I also believe that corporatism and consumerism are more to blame. People have become essentially dependent upon corporations to provide for their livelihoods: food, shelter, communications, entertainment, etc. Companies have removed this from the community realm and have mass produced it. It's at the point now where most people are so busy working in order to have money to buy things that there is simply no time for them to do anything else.
    Yes there were many influences, the industrial revolution, capitalism, corporatism, consumerism, secularism the list could go on but I agree with Robert Nisbet that while these are important it is in the end the state that has been the most important in the destruction of the traditional bases of charity and welfare as it has been in so much of the destruction of traditional, decentralised society. It is to a degree a major support of corporatism itself.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    You have got these backwards. Communism is the ideal classless and stateless society; Socialism is government control of industry in preparation for a transition to Communism.
    .
    Actually, unless you are talking in pure Marxist terms(and that is never a good thing) , neither socialism nor communism necessitate a large role for the state. There are low and no state versions of both from anarcho-communism to guild socialism.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  8. #88
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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeJayH View Post
    so you have no qualms about punishing the innocents born to irresponsible people????
    Those parents who are grossly irresponsible, to the point of being unable to legitimately care for their children, ought to lose their children. It's that simple.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Those parents who are grossly irresponsible, to the point of being unable to legitimately care for their children, ought to lose their children. It's that simple.
    Sounds great in principle. Application is only sound if we have a coherent definition and standard of "irresponsible", "grossly irresponsible", and "legitimate care."

    Outside of the patently obvious criteria that involve physical danger, injury, and harm, I am not certain such a standard has been defined with clarity.

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    Re: Should child bearing be a controlled privilege?

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    Sounds great in principle. Application is only sound if we have a coherent definition and standard of "irresponsible", "grossly irresponsible", and "legitimate care."

    Outside of the patently obvious criteria that involve physical danger, injury, and harm, I am not certain such a standard has been defined with clarity.
    They haven't, simply because there are so many people, both on the loony liberal side and the religious right, who think breeding up a storm is someone's right that cannot be infringed on in any way. The liberals think we ought to pay for them all, the conservatives think we can't interfere in God's will.

    Screw 'em both. If the parents cannot pay for the child's well-being, the parents shouldn't have the children to begin with. That goes above and beyond any "care" issues.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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