View Poll Results: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

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Thread: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

  1. #41
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child
    Simple. When there is no trade with the rest of the world, domestic product quality decreases and cost goes up.
    But that assumes, wrongly, that you have a right to buy things that are not for sale. You don't. You can only choose to purchase things that are legally for sale where you are buying them. If something isn't for sale, then it's not an option for you to purchase them. Ford isn't selling that diesel car in the United States. I am not "forced" to purchase an inferior product because Ford chooses not to sell it here.

    Sounds like you've got a major entitlement issue.
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    But that assumes, wrongly, that you have a right to buy things that are not for sale. You don't. You can only choose to purchase things that are legally for sale where you are buying them. If something isn't for sale, then it's not an option for you to purchase them. Ford isn't selling that diesel car in the United States. I am not "forced" to purchase an inferior product because Ford chooses not to sell it here.

    Sounds like you've got a major entitlement issue.
    Huh?

    I'm not quite sure how you got there from my post. My argument is that isolationism from the trading world results in inferior products at higher prices. That superior products are priced out of competition by protectionism resulting in Americans have little choice if any in the market place. What is left in their price ranges are inferior products that have had their own prices raised. Thus, to purchase things we need, we are forced to buy inferior goods at higher prices.

    The obvious solution is to reject protectionist crap that forces us into such a situation.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  3. #43
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    But that assumes, wrongly, that you have a right to buy things that are not for sale. You don't. You can only choose to purchase things that are legally for sale where you are buying them. If something isn't for sale, then it's not an option for you to purchase them.
    As somebody who buys imported items infrequently, I'm confused by the proceeding statement.
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  4. #44
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Laws that bar slavery are a good thing, as slavery distorts the market.
    Markets do not exist outside of a particular society and social relationships and institutions. To talk of them in so pre-social terms is silly.

    I'm no solid protectionist per se but this basically fundamentalist talk of some free traders about immaculately concieved markets and the gains of free trade thought of in terms only of very narrow economic gains are hardly the most persuasive.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  5. #45
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsonic View Post
    As somebody who buys imported items infrequently, I'm confused by the proceeding statement.
    It was in response to a claim that somehow, not having things for sale domestically somehow limits American's "right" to buy "quality". That's like saying the inability to flap your arms and fly somehow limits your "right" to travel.
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  6. #46
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It was in response to a claim that somehow, not having things for sale domestically somehow limits American's "right" to buy "quality". That's like saying the inability to flap your arms and fly somehow limits your "right" to travel.
    Let's put it this way:

    Liberal Bush imposed a protectionist tariff on steel imported into the US to foolishly protect the domestic goonion steel companies.

    That in turn made ALL products made with steel more expensive, thereby reducing the ability of Americans to buy everything, because they had less money available to buy things.


    Taken to the extreme, Socialist Obama might "rescue" goonion ruined GM by so raising tariffs on "foreign" brand cars that it becomes impossible to buy them, especially in light of all the damage he's going to do to the economy in the next few years. If a person could buy a car, but the government does something, and then it's impossible for that person to buy the car, it's correct to say the government prevented the person from buying that car.

  7. #47
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    When I read the words "goonion", Liberal, Socialist, I remove all credibility from the writer....I'd consider him to be "full of it".
    We must , at least try to keep things in balance..
    I think the steel tariffs were the right thing at the time..

    I do agree that many union men are over paid.. but then, ball players and executives are also excessively compensated....
    These situations have finally come to light with the huge and undeserved bonuses .....and GM's ex-CEO Wagoner and his 23 million dollar golden parachute...
    The way to correct this is a police state with an absolute dictatorship...
    This, I do NOT want....
    What we need is a higher quality of people..
    Everyone should have a parachute, but NOT golden...Wagoner is NOT worth ten times what I am..
    My "parachute" has holes in it, thank God for social security..

  8. #48
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm
    When I read the words "goonion", Liberal, Socialist, I remove all credibility from the writer....I'd consider him to be "full of it".
    Exactly, if you can't make an argument without using childish names, then you don't have an argument worth making. That's pretty much been the standard with the poster, therefore I pretty much ignore everything he has to say.

    I think the steel tariffs were the right thing at the time..
    They were necessary at the time, I don't think they were the right thing. The right thing would have been to eliminate the high union contracts and actually let the steel industry compete on equal ground. Unfortunately, the unions are largely bankrupting this country, they demand more and more and more, but don't take competition and supply and demand into account.

    These situations have finally come to light with the huge and undeserved bonuses .....and GM's ex-CEO Wagoner and his 23 million dollar golden parachute...
    While I do, to some degree, support the right of execs to write whatever contracts they can best negotiate, a lot of these have been utter highway robbery. Wagoner left, not because he was moving on to bigger and better things, but because he FAILED! He was fired and thrown out the door. What's worse, his company is being supported almost entirely with taxpayer money, that, as far as I'm concerned, invalidates any contract he might have had with GM. They're no longer running the show, the American taxpayer is. We never agreed to pay him a dime.
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  9. #49
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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It was in response to a claim that somehow, not having things for sale domestically somehow limits American's "right" to buy "quality".
    How does it not limit quality? Less competition leads to inferior products. Less competition leads to artificial price hikes. By supporting protectionist agendas, you directly limit Americans' capacity to buy high quality goods at low prices and force them into choices between inferior goods at high prices.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

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    Re: Americans should be forced to purchase inferior goods at higher prices

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    How does it not limit quality? Less competition leads to inferior products. Less competition leads to artificial price hikes. By supporting protectionist agendas, you directly limit Americans' capacity to buy high quality goods at low prices and force them into choices between inferior goods at high prices.
    I think you are assuming to much. Most cheap stuff made in China or Vietnam is hardly known for its quality.

    It is almost certain that at least a modest amount of free trade will decrease prices and probably increase quality but this fundamentalist style doctrine that seems to suggest free trade is always the best because it allows "natural" market forces to be unleashed and seems to measure benefits only in very strict and narrow economic terms is hardly the most convincing of arguments.

    One should also not overlook the history of protectionism and free trade which seem to show that most great powers like Britain, Germany and the USA became great economic powers under quite protectionist and/or state interventionist regimes.

    I'm not saying protectionism or state interventionism a good idea, simply that simplistic assertions are unhelpful.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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