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To buy or not to buy...

Question: Should I get this or my daughter's birthday?


  • Total voters
    25
Are you saying that there are no accidents with guns that children have gotten access to?



I don't think he is saying that at all. I think what he is saying is your speculative scenario is extremley rare and rather uncommon.


How many childeren die from accidental shooting?
 
I don't think he is saying that at all. I think what he is saying is your speculative scenario is extremely rare and rather uncommon.


How many children die from accidental shooting?


How many children die of drinking cleaning chemicals? Do you lock those up?

Teaching your child gun safety is the best thing you can do.

If you ban everything that is dangerous to children .. you wont have much left
 
How many children die of drinking cleaning chemicals? Do you lock those up?

Teaching your child gun safety is the best thing you can do.

If you ban everything that is dangerous to children .. you wont have much left




I would like for IT to answer this. ;)


perhaps he can see how irrational he is being.
 
How many children die of drinking cleaning chemicals? Do you lock those up?

Actually, I do lock up the poisonous chemicals in my house, and I don't even have kids.

Teaching your child gun safety is the best thing you can do.

If you ban everything that is dangerous to children .. you wont have much left

I agree you teach a kid gun safety, but you should also lock up the guns. Leaving them with easy access to deadly tools is not really a smart thing to do.
 
Actually, I do lock up the poisonous chemicals in my house, and I don't even have kids.



I agree you teach a kid gun safety, but you should also lock up the guns. Leaving them with easy access to deadly tools is not really a smart thing to do.

sure, thats a given .. i would say the majority of gun owners with children lock their firearms up.

I was just pointing out that chemicals are also dangerous, but most people do not lock those up.

I have no children, so i keep mine unlocked, but on a high shelf.
 
Are you saying that there are no accidents with guns that children have gotten access to?
No, I am saying that you don't have any concrete, rational, supportable reasoning, and you know it.

Recall your statement, that the idea of buying the rifle in question for the daughter in question "is sick", because....

Because someone will not lock up their gun properly and a kid is going to have an accident with it as it looks like a toy.

Please, provide some concrete, rational, supportable, reasoned argument that this WILL happen.
 
sure, thats a given .. i would say the majority of gun owners with children lock their firearms up.

I was just pointing out that chemicals are also dangerous, but most people do not lock those up.

I have no children, so i keep mine unlocked, but on a high shelf.

My nephew and niece come over often enough that I figured locking up the chemicals was a good idea.

But I have to disagree on one thing. Most parents I know nowadays are so paranoid about their kids they not only lock up all the chemicals, but they lock up everything. I swear I think some people would bubble wrap their kids if they could.

When I grew up, we were always coming home wounded from something. I'd come home with a huge cut that was bleeding everywhere and my old man would say "That's nothing. At most four or five stitches. Just put some duct tape on it and stop yer cryin' or I'll put a ribbon in yer hair."

The my mom would come in, look at the cut where ever the hell it was that time, and say "I don't know. That looks pretty bad. I think we should take him to the hospital."

And my old man would say "Stop coddlin' the boy. He'll be fine."

Then she'd roll her eyes and take us to the hospital.

Usually he was wrong and it would take about 8-10 stitches. One time I came back from the hospital with five stitches in my hand and he said "See! I told ya! Duct tape woulda fixed that. Now we've gotta pay that ****in' hospital bill over nothing."

When I was a kid, we didn't get a band-aid for cuts, we got rubbing alcohol, gauze and duct tape.

Teaches character.
 
My nephew and niece come over often enough that I figured locking up the chemicals was a good idea.

But I have to disagree on one thing. Most parents I know nowadays are so paranoid about their kids they not only lock up all the chemicals, but they lock up everything. I swear I think some people would bubble wrap their kids if they could.
I grew up in a house that had several guns in an unlocked glass display cabinet, with the ammunition in the drawer beneath it.

How could I have possibly survived that?
 
I grew up in a house that had several guns in an unlocked glass display cabinet, with the ammunition in the drawer beneath it.

How could I have possibly survived that?

If you were like me, you had parents that taught you about guns and would beat the ever-living **** out of you if you messed with them. :mrgreen:
 
If you were like me, you had parents that taught you about guns and would beat the ever-living **** out of you if you messed with them. :mrgreen:
Well, that's the problem!

The anti-gun loons don't WANT us to teach our kids about guns, even if doing do will keep them safe.

I guess turning people against guns is more important to them than the safety of innocent children.
 
I don't think he is saying that at all. I think what he is saying is your speculative scenario is extremley rare and rather uncommon.


How many childeren die from accidental shooting?

How many more children would die from accidental shooting if all guns were painted like toys?

I don't have any studies to cite that children are more inclined to play with a gun painted like a toy over one that looks like an actual firearm.

I think it's a dangerous thing to paint them that way. I know enough drunken hillbillies that don't practice gun safety. I see no need to add insult to injury so to speak. People may disagree with me.

That's okay too.
 
Actually, I do lock up the poisonous chemicals in my house, and I don't even have kids.



I agree you teach a kid gun safety, but you should also lock up the guns. Leaving them with easy access to deadly tools is not really a smart thing to do.

Not all kids are the same. I was shooting guns since I was 8. My sister hasn't. My father never let her shoot because she is mentally unstable and irresponsible. Not all kids are responsible enough to teach gun safety to. And there is definitely not a one size fits all age to start them at.
 
I don't think anyone here would agree that gun use while intoxicated is a good idea.
 
No, I am saying that you don't have any concrete, rational, supportable reasoning, and you know it.

Recall your statement, that the idea of buying the rifle in question for the daughter in question "is sick", because....



Please, provide some concrete, rational, supportable, reasoned argument that this WILL happen.

I never said that it was sick. You should upgrade your memory.;)

Accidents with children happen.

The 2002 edition of Injury Facts from the National Safety Council reports the following statistics [1] :

* In 1999, 3,385 kids ages 0-19 years were killed with a gun. This includes homicides, suicides, and unintentional injuries.
* This is equivalent to about 9 deaths per day, a figure commonly used by journalists.
* The 3,385 firearms-related deaths for age group 0-19 years breaks down to:
o 214 unintentional
o 1,078 suicides
o 1,990 homicides
o 83 for which the intent could not be determined
o 20 due to legal intervention
* Of the total firearms-related deaths:
o 73 were of children under five years old
o 416 were children 5-14 years old
o 2,896 were 15-19 years old

Your Child | Safety: Guns and Kids

Now you can minimize the deaths and injuries. How many would you draw the line at?
 
I never said that it was sick. You should upgrade your memory.;)
YOU did not.

You did, however, defend the statement by stating that the gun WILL not be locked up and there WILL be an acciddent.

Because someone will not lock up their gun properly and a kid is going to have an accident with it as it looks like a toy.

Now, show that I will not lock up my gun and that my daughter will have an accident, or retract your statement to that effect.
 
I don't think anyone here would agree that gun use while intoxicated is a good idea.

That's here, at DP. We aren't a bunch of drunken hillbillies. :cool:
 
Not all kids are the same. I was shooting guns since I was 8. My sister hasn't. My father never let her shoot because she is mentally unstable and irresponsible. Not all kids are responsible enough to teach gun safety to. And there is definitely not a one size fits all age to start them at.

The irony in my family is that my sister is the anti-gun loon and she's always refused to use a gun, even though she was the most responsible of the three of us. My old man tried taking her out with us shooting to teach her about guns and she was totally against it.

As far as mental stability goes, we're all a little nuts. I'd probably be the most mentally stable of my siblings, which is not saying much for the other two at all.
 
YOU did not.

You did, however, defend the statement by stating that the gun WILL not be locked up and there WILL be an acciddent.



Now, show that I will not lock up my gun and that my daughter will have an accident, or retract your statement to that effect.

Well, there are people that don't lock up their guns. Come to Central Illinois. Accidents do happen. I've shown you evidence. Or was 1999 an anomoly?
 
Well, there are people that don't lock up their guns. Come to Central Illinois. Accidents do happen. I've shown you evidence. Or was 1999 an anomoly?
You're sidestepping.

Show that I will not lock up my gun and that my daughter will have an accident, or retract your statement to that effect.
 
That is misleading.

killed with a gun - does not say the child was the shooter.

If you can find stats where the child was the shooter it would be more useful.

On average in the United States in 2006, someone died in a fire about every 162 minutes, and someone was injured every 32 minutes (Karter 2007).

So thats 8.8 deaths per day. Sounds like we should ban fire.
 
The irony in my family is that my sister is the anti-gun loon and she's always refused to use a gun, even though she was the most responsible of the three of us. My old man tried taking her out with us shooting to teach her about guns and she was totally against it.

As far as mental stability goes, we're all a little nuts. I'd probably be the most mentally stable of my siblings, which is not saying much for the other two at all.

This is true. I was taught gun safety in the same manner as you. We were fortunate. What if we had drunken hillbillies for parents. I have one in my family who has four boys. He thinks a gun is an extention of his penis and likes to show them off when he's drunk. They are not locked up. Thank God that the boys have a responsible mother.
 
You're sidestepping.

Show that I will not lock up my gun and that my daughter will have an accident, or retract your statement to that effect.

Quit strawmanning me. Seriously.

I never said you don't lock up your gun. I never said that your daughter will have an accident.

Take a creative writing course if that will help. Don't misrepresent me here.
 
Quit strawmanning me.
YOU made the statement. I'm taking you task for it. Don't like it? Tough.

Remember that the topic here is specifically about me and the gun I might buy for my daughter. Your statement references me, specifically, as did the "that's sick' statement you responded to.

Show that I will not lock up my gun and that my daughter will have an accident, or retract your statement to that effect.
 
That is misleading.

killed with a gun - does not say the child was the shooter.

If you can find stats where the child was the shooter it would be more useful.

On average in the United States in 2006, someone died in a fire about every 162 minutes, and someone was injured every 32 minutes (Karter 2007).

So thats 8.8 deaths per day. Sounds like we should ban fire.

I'm not for banning the AR-15.

I don't know how many. What is your threshold?

Deputy's child accidentally shoots himself in face : News : KRCG

4 year-old child accidentally shot by his father | Yahoo! News | Local Breaking News and Weather from AZFAMILY.COM & KTVK 3TV - Arizona's Family

2-Year-Old Boy Shoots Mother, Father Charged - wcco.com

There are many stories out there like these. Like a year ago there was a thread here about the 2 year old shooting and killing his father who was a police officer after he had taken his belt off and laid it on the table.

This one is really old, but interesting.

1914: Child accidentally shot by playmate | AspenTimes.com
 
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