View Poll Results: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

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  • Yes

    14 63.64%
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Thread: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

  1. #21
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    You all have it wrong. We need to dump our 2 party system, period.


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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I see a completely different side of this. I see rightwingers becoming more extreme because leftwingers seem to constantly be on the attack and attempting to take away the very beliefs of those on the right. I think a lot of extreme right wingers don't really care much about taxes as much as they do not like having, for example, their religion and the freedom to practice it infringed upon.

    Take for instance the school prayer issue. I don't think schools should be organizing prayer. Most moderate republicans probably don't mind the school not organizing prayer either. However, when rabid leftist, one agenda loudmouths like Cephus come along and attempt to even stop individual students from having expressions of their religion on their free time, quite a few moderates go straight to extreme rapidly. It's a natural reaction to force being applied to them.

    That's just one issue. There are at least half a dozen of these hot button issues and with each one, you have a whole different demographic within the parties that become extreme.
    But that's exactly what I mean by visibly polarizing. Cephus is some guy on a web forum. He doesn't command the attention of millions of listeners. Millions of people do not do as he says. Olberman is a nobody in liberal circles. Cindy Sheehan is an afterthought with most liberals. The most polarizing figures on the left are the ones we're actually ashamed of. I wouldn't know the name of the person that runs PETA or MSNBC but yet I know who Rupert Murdoch and Ted Haggard are. The right takes pride in a far right nut like Coulter saying that women shouldn't be allowed to vote(What the **** was that about anyways?). They hold Rush Limbaugh as some sort of Golden Boy behind the mic. The left ostracizes it's most polarizing and radical figures while the right supports theirs.
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  3. #23
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    What is so extreme is that you, and many others, have a very narrow view of what those things entail, and view anyone who disagrees with you on anything as an enemy of freedom. Even the tone of the question you just asked confirms your moral superiority (in your own mind) to anyone who disagrees with you.

    Are there any realistic circumstances where you would support tax increases? Are there any realistic circumstances where you would support negotiating with (and making real concessions to) adversarial nations instead of threatening them?

    I didn't think so.
    When the evidence shows that tax money is being wasted and that tax reductions spur greater economic growth why would you want to pay more taxes?

    In 1982 Ronald Reagan got the US out of double digit unemployment and crippling inflation not by raising taxes but by LOWERING TAXES.

    When you see what Obama's attempt to negotiate with Russia resulted in this past week you can better understand that diplomacy is best conducted from a position of strength.

    Obama offered to drop the Eastern European Missile Shield plan if Russia would cooperate with us on preventing Iran from going nuclear.

    This offer was made confidentially.

    Medvedev refused Obama's request and made him look foolish by exposing the offer AND turning him down.

    So much for negotiating from weakness.

    I don't need our govt. to threaten any nation necessarily and the fact is that most diplomacy IS conducted without threats. I don't know where or how you get the idea that threats are always necessary.

    But when negotiating without strength the other side has no reason to compromise.

    Why should they?

    And if they won't compromise then you have no negotiation.

    OBL 11/24/02

  4. #24
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    You all have it wrong. We need to dump our 2 party system, period.
    What two party system? The one where ANYONE can start a party, run on a platform and get elected? I hate when people say 'two party system' like there is some plot in place and nobody else can get elected.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    You all have it wrong. We need to dump our 2 party system, period.
    In favor of...?

    OBL 11/24/02

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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    But that's exactly what I mean by visibly polarizing. Cephus is some guy on a web forum. He doesn't command the attention of millions of listeners.
    No, but there are polarizing atheist figures who have made every effort to command the courts. And it's worked...cities have been known to tell little old lady's they can't have Christmas decorations on their doors for fear of law suits.

    Millions of people do not do as he says. Olberman is a nobody in liberal circles. Cindy Sheehan is an afterthought with most liberals. The most polarizing figures on the left are the ones we're actually ashamed of.
    It's not about how many millions listen to Olbermann or Rush. Rush does not lead the Republican party. Pelosi is an extremely polarizing figure and she is the speaker of the house right now.

    I wouldn't know the name of the person that runs PETA or MSNBC but yet I know who Rupert Murdoch and Ted Haggard are.
    Yeah and I am well aware of who Soros and Ayers are...

    The right takes pride in a far right nut like Coulter saying that women shouldn't be allowed to vote(What the **** was that about anyways?). They hold Rush Limbaugh as some sort of Golden Boy behind the mic. The left ostracizes it's most polarizing and radical figures while the right supports theirs.
    No, this isn't the case at all. Coulter is a joke and despite what the white house is telling you right now, Rush doesn't lead the party.

  7. #27
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    What two party system? The one where ANYONE can start a party, run on a platform and get elected? I hate when people say 'two party system' like there is some plot in place and nobody else can get elected.
    I think his comment was more to the point of the duopoly of the Democratic and Republican parties. Third parties as they are called don't stand a prayers chance in hell of getting elected.

    But there is a reason for that. People choose to be Democrat, Republican, Green, Socialist, etc. So I certainly see your point Hatuey. And sort of see his too.

    It's political survival of the fittest. Start your own party, and every four years you'll be tied to the tree and hit in the head with a shovel.
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    The media in this country makes it almost impossible for anyone other than the Republican or Democrat party candidates viable, period.

    No other party's have the money to even challenge the major party's, and they are the problem.

    Our government does not represent the people, they represent themselves and the people who pay for them to be elected.

    Open your eyes people. The R's and D's are 2 sides of the same coin.


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  9. #29
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad View Post
    When the evidence shows that tax money is being wasted and that tax reductions spur greater economic growth why would you want to pay more taxes?
    I noticed you didn't answer my question. Are there any realistic circumstances where you would ever support raising taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad
    In 1982 Ronald Reagan got the US out of double digit unemployment and crippling inflation not by raising taxes but by LOWERING TAXES.
    Thank you for providing an example of your extremism. You don't see any gray area at all, nor acknowledge that circumstances are ever different. Your favorite policies are right for all-time, and no other policy could ever be right under any circumstance. The only lesson to be learned from that is "tax cuts = gud LOL." Never mind that the top tax rate was TWICE as high then as it is now. Nope, the lesson to be learned is that since Reagan's tax cuts arguably stimulated the economy, ALL tax cuts must therefore stimulate the economy regardless of the circumstance.

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad
    When you see what Obama's attempt to negotiate with Russia resulted in this past week you can better understand that diplomacy is best conducted from a position of strength.

    Obama offered to drop the Eastern European Missile Shield plan if Russia would cooperate with us on preventing Iran from going nuclear.

    This offer was made confidentially.

    Medvedev refused Obama's request and made him look foolish by exposing the offer AND turning him down.
    And here is another example. You take ONE example (and not even a very good example) of something and use it as evidence that a policy can NEVER work (or that it always works). That is a hallmark of an extremist ideologue.

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad
    So much for negotiating from weakness.

    I don't need our govt. to threaten any nation necessarily and the fact is that most diplomacy IS conducted without threats. I don't know where or how you get the idea that threats are always necessary.

    But when negotiating without strength the other side has no reason to compromise.

    Why should they?
    OK then. Please define "negotiating from strength," and what President Bhkad would do to get us to that position, and how we should deal with our adversaries until we get there.

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad
    And if they won't compromise then you have no negotiation.
    It takes two to tango, buddy. You just ruled out compromise (i.e. "negotiating from weakness") and then accused Russia of being unwilling to compromise. Good thing you aren't president.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 03-05-09 at 12:55 AM.
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  10. #30
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    Re: Should The GOP Have A Moderate Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad View Post
    When you see what Obama's attempt to negotiate with Russia resulted in this past week you can better understand that diplomacy is best conducted from a position of strength.

    Obama offered to drop the Eastern European Missile Shield plan if Russia would cooperate with us on preventing Iran from going nuclear.

    This offer was made confidentially.

    Medvedev refused Obama's request and made him look foolish by exposing the offer AND turning him down.
    Where do you get your news?

    "We have received this letter. It was in fact a reply to a letter from Medvedev sent to Obama after his appointment. The letter contained an assessment of the situation, but there were no concrete proposals about any mutually binding decisions," Natalya Timakova told reporters during a visit by Medvedev to Spain.
    Russia says Obama letter has nothing concrete

    “If we talk about some bargain or exchange, I can say that the issues were not raised in this way, because it’s counterproductive,” Mr. Medvedev said at a news conference in Madrid, where he was meeting with the Spanish prime minister.

    “What we are getting from our U.S. partners shows at least one thing, that our U.S. partners are ready to discuss the issue,” he said. “That’s good, because only a few months ago we were getting different signals — that the decision has been made, there is nothing to talk about, that we will do everything as it has been decided.”
    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/04/wa...de4&ei=5087%0A

    The Kremlin also disputed talk of any trade-off in the letter. In Moscow, a Kremlin source told FOX News there was no quid pro quo on Iran and missile defense in the letter, but said the correspondence was considered very positive and contained a number of initiatives.
    Obama: Letter to Moscow Addressed Missile Shield, Did Not Offer Trade-Off - First 100 Days of Presidency - Politics FOXNews.com


    I will now you return you all to the regularly scheduled debate.

    And of course the republican party needs to have moderates,m this is not a country of extremists. All parties need moderates and moderation, all that a trend towards extremes does is further the destructive polarization. I'm with Blackdog, although politically on the other side of the spectrum it appears, we need to ditch the entire 2 party system.
    Last edited by marduc; 03-05-09 at 01:12 AM.

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