View Poll Results: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

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  • Yes (see follow-up questions)

    8 15.09%
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    45 84.91%
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Thread: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

  1. #1
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Its already been made public that The Obama looks to reinstate an 'assault weapon' ban:

    ABC News: Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban

    Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    If you answered 'yes', please answer these questions:

    -What positive effect did the 1994-2004 AWB have on crime?
    -If you cannot specify a verifiable positive effect, then why do you support another ban?


    <poll pending>
    Choices:
    Yes
    No

  2. #2
    Another day in paradise..
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    I voted no, I will wait for some of the Obama supporters to state why they do support it before I answer.


    Matthew 10:34
    Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

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    Sage
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Not in the least. I think most of the restrictions against guns should be lifted (like not being able to own fully automatics, etc).
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  4. #4
    Norville Rogers
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Back in '04 the DOJ wrote a report about the AWB's effects

    Source [National Criminal Justice Reference Service | Updated Assessment of the Federal Assault Weapons Ban: Impacts on Gun Markets and Gun Violence, 1994-2003] (PDF)

    The Banned Guns and Magazines Were Used in Up to A Quarter of Gun Crimes
    Prior to the Ban

    ē AWs were used in only a small fraction of gun crimes prior to the ban: about 2%
    according to most studies and no more than 8%. Most of the AWs used in crime
    are assault pistols rather than assault rifles.

    ē LCMs are used in crime much more often than AWs and accounted for 14% to
    26% of guns used in crime prior to the ban.

    ē AWs and other guns equipped with LCMs tend to account for a higher share of
    guns used in murders of police and mass public shootings, though such incidents
    are very rare.

    The Banís Success in Reducing Criminal Use of the Banned Guns and Magazines
    Has Been Mixed

    ē Following implementation of the ban, the share of gun crimes involving AWs
    declined by 17% to 72% across the localities examined for this study (Baltimore,
    Miami, Milwaukee, Boston, St. Louis, and Anchorage), based on data covering all
    or portions of the 1995-2003 post-ban period. This is consistent with patterns
    found in national data on guns recovered by police and reported to ATF.

    ē The decline in the use of AWs has been due primarily to a reduction in the use of
    assault pistols (APs), which are used in crime more commonly than assault rifles
    (ARs). There has not been a clear decline in the use of ARs, though assessments
    are complicated by the rarity of crimes with these weapons and by substitution of
    post-ban rifles that are very similar to the banned AR models.

    ē However, the decline in AW use was offset throughout at least the late 1990s by
    steady or rising use of other guns equipped with LCMs in jurisdictions studied
    (Baltimore, Milwaukee, Louisville, and Anchorage). The failure to reduce LCM
    use has likely been due to the immense stock of exempted pre-ban magazines,
    which has been enhanced by recent imports.

    It is Premature to Make Definitive Assessments of the Banís Impact on Gun Crime

    ē Because the ban has not yet reduced the use of LCMs in crime, we cannot clearly
    credit the ban with any of the nationís recent drop in gun violence. However, the
    banís exemption of millions of pre-ban AWs and LCMs ensured that the effects of the law would occur only gradually. Those effects are still unfolding and may
    not be fully felt for several years into the future, particularly if foreign, pre-ban
    LCMs continue to be imported into the U.S. in large numbers.
    It would seem that the largest effect of the ban was seen due to restritions on weapons with Large Capacity Magazines, and that exemptions greatly reduced its effectiveness. I don't have a strong opinion about the AWB (I really don't see anything negative about banning assault weapons), and am generally against gun control, but from the DOJ report I would have to conclude that the AWB was effective, and would have been much more effective had it been stronger.
    Last edited by Kernel Sanders; 03-03-09 at 04:14 PM.

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    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    It would seem that the largest effect of the ban was seen due to restritions on weapons with Large Capacity Magazines, and that exemptions greatly reduced its effectiveness.
    "Exemptions" like existing magazines beng grandfathered.
    Do you suppose that will change?

    but from the DOJ report I would have to conclude that the AWB was effective, and would have been much more effective had it been stronger.
    The DOJ report uses terms like:
    -The Banís Success in Reducing Criminal Use of the Banned Guns and Magazines Has Been Mixed
    -It is Premature to Make Definitive Assessments of the Banís Impact on Gun Crime
    -we cannot clearly credit the ban with any of the nationís recent drop in gun violence.

    Given that, how do you support the position that the AWB was effective?

  6. #6
    Norville Rogers
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    "Exemptions" like existing magazines beng grandfathered.
    Do you suppose that will change?
    The weapons that were grandfathered in are now a decade and a half old. If I had to guess I'd say that either the exemptions would not be included, or that exempt weapons and equipment would be far less prevalent. I do not know for sure if the same exemptions are included again, though.


    The DOJ report uses terms like:
    -The Banís Success in Reducing Criminal Use of the Banned Guns and Magazines Has Been Mixed
    -It is Premature to Make Definitive Assessments of the Banís Impact on Gun Crime
    -we cannot clearly credit the ban with any of the nationís recent drop in gun violence.

    Given that, how do you support the position that the AWB was effective?
    The report is careful to avoid crediting the nationwide drop in gun violence to the AWB, but the effects on crime involving assault weapons are clear.

    Following implementation of the ban, the share of gun crimes involving AWs
    declined by 17% to 72% across the localities examined for this study
    Additionally, one of the reasons for the mixed results are the exemptions that weakened the bill

    However, the decline in AW use was offset throughout at least the late 1990s by
    steady or rising use of other guns equipped with LCMs in jurisdictions studied
    (Baltimore, Milwaukee, Louisville, and Anchorage). The failure to reduce LCM
    use has likely been due to the immense stock of exempted pre-ban magazines,
    which has been enhanced by recent imports.
    To expand on one of the quotes you used (the part not included in your post is quoted is in bold)

    Because the ban has not yet reduced the use of LCMs in crime, we cannot clearly credit the ban with any of the nationís recent drop in gun violence.
    From the report I would conclude that the ban definitely had an effect on gun violence involving AWs and LCMs, that those effects were positive, and that the reason that the effects were not larger and more definitive was exemptions that weakened the restrictions.

  7. #7
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    -What positive effect did the 1994-2004 AWB have on crime?
    -If you cannot specify a verifiable positive effect, then why do you support another ban?
    Crime in the large US cities have gone down since the ban..

    Assault weapons in cities is just something you do not need.. On the countryside/rural areas I support them. It should be banned in some states.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

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    Human 2.0
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Not in the least. I think most of the restrictions against guns should be lifted (like not being able to own fully automatics, etc).
    You think anyone without a felony conviction should be able to own fully automatic weapons? In any states? In urban areas? With no restrictions, such as "only former military or police personnel"..
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

  9. #9
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    Crime in the large US cities have gone down since the ban..

    Assault weapons in cities is just something you do not need.. On the countryside/rural areas I support them. It should be banned in some states.
    AWB didn't ban any guns you know. It was more like accessories. And if someone in the country can use gun A, then there is no reason why people in the city should be forbidden from having gun A.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #10
    Sage
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    Re: Do you support a new ban on 'assault weapons'?

    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    You think anyone without a felony conviction should be able to own fully automatic weapons? In any states? In urban areas? With no restrictions, such as "only former military or police personnel"..
    Fully automatic weapons should be completely legal. And any criminal who has finished the full of their punishment (including probation) should have the full of their rights recognized.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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