View Poll Results: Do you think downloading movies and other content should be illegal?

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    14 25.93%
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Thread: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

  1. #81
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    A thief is a thief no matter what or how they steal.
    Again, there is nothing being stolen. Stealing implies that I am taking something from someone, which means that they no longer have it.

    As someone rightly pointed out, this is just like recording TV with a VCR; the only difference is the extent to which it is happening.

    Since this is a discussion on the legalities, the argument you/I make is stronger, since the court has made the distinction numerous times.
    That might be true, but it's an incredibly precarious position from which to argue, as the most ridiculous decisions are made by courts on a regular basis. Frankly I don't care whether or not the courts find it to be legal; the question is whether or not it is a violation of someone's property rights.

    Of course, I'm a communist, and I want to take all of your property away anyways, so what do I know, right?
    Last edited by Khayembii Communique; 02-16-09 at 10:33 AM.

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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    While I don't condone thievery, I don't feel remotely sorry for Hollywood about this. The movies they churn out are absolutely horrible and getting worse by the year.

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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    Links please that show those court decisions that have said it is OK to copy/distribute copyrighted materal without the copyright holder's consent.
    Stop grasping at straws, you know DAMN WELL that is NOT what my repy was about and NOT what I am arguing, which was the separation of copying media and theft of physical product. Of course copying copyrighted ,material outside of the confines of fair use is illegal, but it ain't theft, it is... oh wait... COPYRIGHTINFRINGEMENT


    Jeez, does reading comprehension mean ANYTHING anymore?
    Last edited by Travelsonic; 02-16-09 at 11:57 AM.
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  4. #84
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    I look at it this way. It's OK to record a physical copy of <insert movie/music here> and give that physical copy to another person as a gift. There are no laws against it. So why should downloading it from the net be illegal? As long as it is done without charging money for it then it's not a copyright infringement as far as I am concerned. Before the age of computers no one cared if you copied something so long as you didn't pass it off as your own work. A person could make a copy of Hamlet and pass it around and no one cared, again so long as they didn't pass it off as their own work.

    I agree with much of what you said. Its no different than I making a chair and someone making a copy of that chair I made or if I see a miniature wall hung curio cabinet and I make an exact duplicate of it at home(which I have done. This does not constitute theft. To call it theft is laughable, absurd, and diminishes the definition and people's perception of theft.

    I know the argument of "it takes money away from the original authors/actors etc etc but I just don't see it.
    As far as I know these actors are paid first. I do not think any actor would say "Hey lets see how well the movie does in theaters and dvd/blueray sales first and then pay me". Because even some of the movies with the biggest stars have flopped.
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  5. #85
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsonic View Post
    ...
    , but it ain't theft, it is... oh wait... COPYRIGHTINFRINGEMENT
    ...
    A distinction without a difference in the context of this thread. Trying to justify theft by calling it copyright infringment is simply another way to rationalize. You do have a gift for it though.

  6. #86
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    A distinction without a difference in the context of this thread. Trying to justify theft by calling it copyright infringment is simply another way to rationalize. You do have a gift for it though.
    Not nearly as great as your gift of illiteracy though. Nowhere did I say it was ok regardless of what it was, which is actually required for justification and not merely disagreeing with you.

    Actually, the difference is not only blatantly obvious, but very important - This thread talks aqbout the LEGALITY.

    The LAW referrs to piracy as copyright infringement:

    copyright infringement - a violation of the rights secured by a copyright
    and not theft:

    theft n. the generic term for all crimes in which a person intentionally and fraudulently takes personal property of another without permission or consent and with the intent to convert it to the taker's use (including potential sale). In many states, if the value of the property taken is low (for example, less than $500) the crime is "petty theft," but it is "grand theft" for larger amounts, designated misdemeanor, or felony, respectively. Theft is synonymous with "larceny." Although robbery (taking by force), burglary (taken by entering unlawfully), and embezzlement (stealing from an employer) are all commonly thought of as theft, they are distinguished by the means and methods used, and are separately designated as those types of crimes in criminal charges and statutory punishments. (See: larceny, robbery, burglary, embezzlement)
    So not only is the distinction there, but it is important. The case against Grokster, IIRC, the judge called out the representative for the RIAA for misusing terms. (same ones you and I are quibbling over too).

    Simpler way to state my point: Name one person infrining upon copyright or pirating goods who was charged with theft and not copyright infringement. One. I'm waiting.
    Last edited by Travelsonic; 02-16-09 at 02:24 PM.
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  7. #87
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    TOJ, theft is a criminal charge in which physical property is taken unlawfully. Theft is investigated by the police and those convicted are sentenced by a criminal court.

    Copyright infringement is a civil matter, in which a lawsuit is brought by the damaged party. Someone convicted in a civil court pays damages.

    They are entirely separate legal issues. If you called copyright infringement theft in a court of law, you would get reprimanded by the judge. It is incorrect terminology.

  8. #88
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    I can't remember who it was but one of the huge British rock stars told Jay Leno that he just illegally downloaded new music he wanted to hear it.

    Everybody laughed.

    Sure it's illegal but it's hard to get people to have any sort of sympathy for multimillionaires. I'm sure a common justification is "well I've bought their music before!"

  9. #89
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    The vast amount of money goes to the record companies anyways. If you want to support the artist then donate or go see them in person. Buying CD's to support artists makes no sense.

  10. #90
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    Re: Do you think downloading movies or other content should be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    The vast amount of money goes to the record companies anyways. If you want to support the artist then donate or go see them in person. Buying CD's to support artists makes no sense.
    Musicians should be better at exploring and using the possibilities of new technology to avoid the record companies. Their music would get cheaper and they could earn more at the same time.

    For once I agree with you completely. Donation and live performances is the real thing anyways. Thats a real token of appreciation.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

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