View Poll Results: 2-part question. See OP. Please explain your answer.

Voters
18. You may not vote on this poll
  • No - No

    15 83.33%
  • No - Yes

    0 0%
  • Yes - No

    0 0%
  • Yes - Yes

    3 16.67%
Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 LastLast
Results 111 to 120 of 136

Thread: If you are fighting...

  1. #111
    R.I.P. Léo
    bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    05-17-12 @ 01:54 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    9,649

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    muhajadeen - generic term
    Mujahadeen - specific term
    Taliban - specific term

    You are arging that because the Taliban are mujahadeen, they are then also the Muhajadeen.

    See the flaw?
    My dictionary does not make the difference between "Mujahideen" and "mujahideen". Maybe you can show me one that does?

  2. #112
    Filmmaker Lawyer Patriot
    Harshaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:14 AM
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    21,968

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    No, because Mujahideen is a more generic term.

    The Brits have secret service
    The Nazis had the Gestapo

    Gestapo = secret service
    'Fraid not.

    All you did was mix it around. It still comes out to MI5 = Gestapo, because they're both "secret service."
    2001-2008: Dissent is the highest form of patriotism.
    2009-2016: Dissent is the highest form of racism.
    2017-? (Probably): Dissent is the highest form of misogyny.

  3. #113
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 12:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    No, because Mujahideen is a more generic term.
    Not when you're using it in its specific meaning to describe the organization that fought the Soviets.
    His equation stands.

  4. #114
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 12:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    My dictionary does not make the difference between "Mujahideen" and "mujahideen". Maybe you can show me one that does?
    And that, folks, is where any question as to your seriousness ends.

  5. #115
    R.I.P. Léo
    bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    05-17-12 @ 01:54 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    9,649

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    You continue to fail to understand that you being a "freedom fighter" isnt determined by who does or does not refer to you as such.
    Then how is it determined? There are different possible definitions, as this term is subjective, just like "terrorist".

    I just pointed out the fact that "During the Cold War, the term freedom fighter was used by the United States and other Western Bloc countries to describe rebels in countries controlled by communist states or otherwise under the influence of the Soviet Union, including rebels in Hungary, the anti-communist Contras in Nicaragua, UNITA in Angola and the multi-factional mujahideen in Afghanistan, as well as rebels in Indian-administered Kashmir."

    Freedom fighter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  6. #116
    R.I.P. Léo
    bub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Last Seen
    05-17-12 @ 01:54 PM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    9,649

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    'Fraid not.

    All you did was mix it around. It still comes out to MI5 = Gestapo, because they're both "secret service."
    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Not when you're using it in its specific meaning to describe the organization that fought the Soviets.
    His equation stands.
    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    And that, folks, is where any question as to your seriousness ends.
    PM me when you find an argument other that "in my mind, and in spite of what the dictionary says, I refer to the ones who fought against USSR and not to the Mujahideen"

    And Goobieman, you skipped that again:
    Both Mujahideen and Taliban (who are a kind of Mujahideen according to the Merriam Webster dictionary) are Islamists.

    Islamists struggle in order to establish an Islamist state.

    The Mujahideens in the 80's have established the "Islamic state of Afghanistan"
    The Taliban (who are also Mujahideen) have the same ideology, they fight for the same thing, "though the Taliban subscribed to a particularly narrow interpretation of Islam"

    Much of the civil war could be characterized as an ethnic conflict between the Pashtun Taliban, and the non-Pashtun Northern Alliance, since both sides of the conflict espoused fundamentalist Islam.


    So, they fight for the same thing, the difference is that Talibans are Pashtun

  7. #117
    Filmmaker Lawyer Patriot
    Harshaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:14 AM
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    21,968

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    PM me when you find an argument other that "in my mind, and in spite of what the dictionary says, I refer to the ones who fought against USSR and not to the Mujahideen"
    When what Reagan said or didn't say becomes relevant to the poll -- or the concept -- you PM . . . someone.
    2001-2008: Dissent is the highest form of patriotism.
    2009-2016: Dissent is the highest form of racism.
    2017-? (Probably): Dissent is the highest form of misogyny.

  8. #118
    Counselor

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Pacific Northwest, Oregon
    Last Seen
    11-07-09 @ 04:25 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    1,856

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    ...for the power to create a murderous, oppressive, theocratic government, are you fighting for freedom?

    If not, then can you be a 'freedom fighter'?

    Please explain your answers.
    Wow, you must be very glad that we got rid of George Bush, so we won't have to through that.

  9. #119
    Matthew 16:3
    Tucker Case's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Everywhere and nowhere
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:39 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    45,365

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    Then how is it determined? There are different possible definitions, as this term is subjective, just like "terrorist".
    In correct usage, they are not subjective, bub. To be a freedom fighter, you must fight for freedom. To be a terrorist, you must purposely target civilians.

    Even if I incorrectly label a group that targets civilians as "freedom fighters", if they are not fighting for freedom, that label is incorrect.

    Let's use an example: A group lives in a society where they enjoy many things that we label as basic freedoms, but they choose not to partake of many of these freedoms. Now, this group does not like that other people can engage in these freedoms and it is their desire to live in a society where basic freedoms are denied to the people.

    They take up armed conflict against the rulers of this society.


    They cannot be correctly labelled "freedom fighters" because it is their desire to eliminate the freedom which already extant, and replace it with oppression.



    Now let's say that they do not target civilians. In fact they take pains to prevent civilian casualties. Then they ALSO cannot be labelled "terrorists", because they do not engage in terrorism.

    In this case, the only names that could apply that would be accurate would be "Rebels", "Insurgents", "Dissidents", "Paramilitary group" etc.



    Conversely, lets say there is a group that lives in an oppresive society. They choose to take up arms in order to overthrow this oppresive regime and instill a free society. They can correctly be labelled "freedom fighters".

    But let's say that this particular group purposely targets civilians in order to achieve their goals. Then they would also be terrorists.

    One can be both freedom fighter and terrorist.

    One label is regarding WHAT they are fighting for, the other is regarding HOW they go about fighting for it.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  10. #120
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 12:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: If you are fighting...

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonslayer View Post
    Wow, you must be very glad that we got rid of George Bush, so we won't have to through that.
    Please refrain from polluting this thread with your usual useless partisan bigotry.

Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •