View Poll Results: Will aliens be hostile or friendly

Voters
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  • Friendly

    42 52.50%
  • Hostile

    25 31.25%
  • We are alone

    13 16.25%
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Thread: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

  1. #131
    Educator Grateful Heart's Avatar
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post

    The most likely thing to happen will be that they consider us uninteresting and completely ignore us.
    Probably not. Based on our own experience, the most likely reason an advanced civilization would first travel to our solar system is for scientific exploration. Since planets with life are presumably few and far between, the earth and its lifeforms would probably be highly interesting to them, if only from a laboratory perspective. That doesn't mean they'd want to 'make friends' or see us as anything more than lab specimens. But I do think they'd examine us in great detail.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    The second most likely thing is that they will consider us or our planet a natural resource of some kind and will take possession of whatever they need.
    It's unlikely that a civilization so advanced that it can accomplish interstellar travel would come here because it had 'run out' of food or oil or hydrogen or plutonium or arable soil. It's unlikely that such a civilization would require our solar system or our planet for 'natural resources.' There would no doubt be plenty of sources of natural resources to be found much nearer to their home planet. And I've got to assume that the reliance on consumption of 'natural resources' will be a problem that such an advanced civilization may well have overcome anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dezaad View Post
    The third and least most likely thing will be that they find us interesting after all, will respect our life and become benevolent friends.
    There's really so much speculation involved in this that it's hard to say one way or the other. We can imagine a civilization so advanced that they would have difficulty 'communicating' with us at all in any way that they would find meaningful. Much as we lack the ability to communicate with the great apes except by teaching them the most rudimentary language skills using visual aids. We tend to view our communication with the great apes as something less than profound. I think the aliens might feel the same about communication with us.

    But for some reason I'm now reminded of that old saying... "A dog is man's best friend!"


  2. #132
    Sage

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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Friendly, but foolish to come here.

  3. #133
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Unless there is something fundamental to the laws of physics that is unknown to us, even if there is a very, very advanced alien civilization out there somewhere in the universe, there is no way that they could ever travel this far to visit us anyway.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  4. #134
    Educator Grateful Heart's Avatar
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Unless there is something fundamental to the laws of physics that is unknown to us, even if there is a very, very advanced alien civilization out there somewhere in the universe, there is no way that they could ever travel this far to visit us anyway.
    I think it's fair to say the MOST of the things which are fundamental to the laws of physics are unknown to us. I read a very interesting piece by a top physicist recently which flatly stated that with every new discovery we make, a dozen new questions are raised. There may be some debate about this, but I think the consensus is that we are not getting closer to identifying the laws of the universe... we're simply in the process of identifying and categorizing all the questions.


  5. #135
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    they will be very friendly right up to the moment that the entree is served

    What amazes me is the number of people who voted "we are alone". That reflects either incredible ignorance to the size of the universe or incredible arrogance that "God" thinks we are so special he broke the mold after he made Earth.
    Last edited by WillRockwell; 04-03-09 at 07:27 PM.

  6. #136
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Disdainful and disparaging, is my guess.

    Kind of the way liberals act toward those who disagree with them. But in this case the aliens would be justified in adopting a superior manner toward humanity.

    EDIT: By the way, I didn't vote because there was no "Other" option.
    Last edited by bhkad; 04-03-09 at 07:42 PM.

    OBL 11/24/02

  7. #137
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Quote Originally Posted by bhkad View Post
    Disdainful and disparaging, is my guess.

    Kind of the way liberals act toward those who disagree with them. But in this case the aliens would be justified in adopting a superior manner toward humanity.

    EDIT: By the way, I didn't vote because there was no "Other" option.
    and like alot of atheists too

    Human Taxidermist - - now offering his services for all your loved ones
    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

  8. #138
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grateful Heart View Post
    Probably not. Based on our own experience, the most likely reason an advanced civilization would first travel to our solar system is for scientific exploration.

    It's unlikely that a civilization so advanced that it can accomplish interstellar travel would come here because it had 'run out' of food or oil or hydrogen or plutonium or arable soil. It's unlikely that such a civilization would require our solar system or our planet for 'natural resources.'
    Because of the incomprehensible number of planets out there this creates the overwhelming likelyhood of there literally being millions of advanced civilizations out there.

    I personally believe it to be very likely at least a couple of them do nothing but expand like a growing bubble. Probably out numbering humans much more than a trillion to one. Taking over every useable solar system that increasingly becomes within their reach. Like a growing bubble consuming everything in its path. Like a swarm of locusts or an expanding colony of ants.

    I picture these lifeforms doing nothing but rapidly multiplying and perhaps even through evolution lost any sense of emotion or compassion and only have a sense of driving their proliferation as a species. Perhaps we had a stroke of luck that Earth is so far off by itself compared to many other groups of planets. Perhaps the reason why SETI does not pick up signals is because most advanced civilizations were smart enough not to advertise their presence. Perhapse sending out radio waves will attract the advanced predators like a pack of wolves running toward a deer call.
    Last edited by creativedreams; 04-03-09 at 08:04 PM.

  9. #139
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    As former SC Senator Fritz Hollings might have said, "They's a whole lotta assumin' going on out theah!"

    Hundreds, maybe thousands, of novels and short stories have been written about what "First Contact" might be like. All of them could be equally valid or invalid, since we know virtually nothing about life on other worlds... if there even is any intelligent life elsewhere in our galaxy.

    Some here likely know of the Drake Equation. Here's a brief explanation for those who might be unfamiliar with it:

    N= R x Fp x Ne x Fe x Fi x Fc x L

    where:

    N is the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which communication might be possible;
    and

    R* is the average rate of star formation in our galaxy
    fp is the fraction of those stars that have planets
    ne is the average number of planets that can potentially support life per star that has planets
    fℓ is the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop life at some point
    fi is the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop intelligent life
    fc is the fraction of civilizations that develop a technology that releases detectable signs of their existence into space
    L is the length of time such civilizations release detectable signals into space.

    Frank Drake formulated his equation in 1960 for SETI. The Drake equation is closely related to the Fermi paradox in that Drake suggested that a large number of extraterrestrial civilizations would form, but that the lack of evidence of such civilizations (the Fermi paradox) suggests that technological civilizations tend to destroy themselves rather quickly.

    Drake's values give N = 10 0.5 2 1 0.01 0.01 10,000 = 10.
    Using optimistic assumptions:
    N = 20 0.1 0.5 1 0.5 0.1 100,000 = 5,000 hi-tech civilizations
    Using pessimistic assumptions:
    N = 10 0.5 2 1 0.001 0.01 500 = 0.05 (we are probably alone)

    ...con't below...

  10. #140
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    Re: Will aliens be friendly or hostile?

    So, if we figured that there were 5 high-tech civilizations in our galaxy at any given moment...the nearest could easily be tens of thousands of light-years away.

    Even if we assume the (imo, highly optimistic) 5000 technological civilizations, the nearest could be dozens or hundreds of light years away.

    SETI's lack of success would probably argue that the more optimistic equation values are probably too high, and the nearest civilization (if there is one) is more than a thousand light years away. Long way to come visit.

    Now, let's consider ways and means... currently we have little theoretical basis for faster-than-light travel, mostly just some speculation based on hypothesis considered "fringe" by the scientific establishment. Yet, as someone noted, we are probably vastly more ignorant of the true physical laws of the universe than we think we are. Note how the extrasolar planet search has revealed results drastically different from what the scientific establishment expected.

    So...there's relativistic (near-c) space travel, using theoretical time dilation to make the journey seem livable. Approaching c (light speed) using reaction drives systems we can conceive of but not yet build, would be very expensive for even a very small payload. There's also the cosmic ray and micrometeor problems, due to blue-shift and ultra-velocity impacts respectively. Unmanned seems more likely than manned, barring some kind of reactionless drive system and advanced navigational shield.

    There's also the slow-travel "ark" or "cold sleep" concepts, with decades or centuries passing in transit, and travellers either in suspended animation, or else living and dying by generations during the transit. Still expensive and difficult, but the possibility of live visitors exists.

    Only with the relativistic ship would a civilization likely travel more than a few dozen light years from home.

    Now, FTL (faster than light)... no real theoretical basis, more like scientific speculations such as the Alcubierre Warp Drive (a mathmatical construct which could theoretically exceed lightspeed, but the energy requirements are enormous). Even more speculatively, wormholes, hyperspace, etc. What the "speeds" and limitations of such an FTL drive might be, we could not know and speculation is probably useless.

    SO, we probably only get visitors in sublight ships if they are pretty close by, less than a hundred light years...and SETI results suggest that is unlikely. Even then, a giant fleet with invading armies is improbable given the massive resources involved in such an effort.

    Of course, extremely advanced aliens might not need a huge army to exterminate us... but would aliens necessarily be that much more advanced?


    ...con't....

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