View Poll Results: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

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  • Yes we will see them and they are justified.

    5 7.81%
  • Yes we will see them but they will not be justified.

    4 6.25%
  • No we will not see them but they would have been justified.

    21 32.81%
  • No we will not see them and they would not have been justified.

    34 53.13%
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Thread: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

  1. #71
    Banned Billo_Really's Avatar
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    I always find it amusing when the Die hard Bush Bashers falsely claim that Bush lied to get us into Iraq. They seem to conveniently forget that even democrats themselves said Saddam had WMDs and this was before Bush was even in office, that Saddam has had WMDs before and has used them, that Saddam kept blocking UN inspectors and gave the impression that he did have WMDs. With those things in mind anyone who says Bush lied to get us into Iraq is either a koolaid drinking liar or a kooliad drinking ****en moron.
    I've already proven beyond a shadow of a doubt Bush lied about the Iraqi threat, yet you still spew out this bull****. Bush said Hussein wouldn't allow inspectors back into Iraq. He said this while inspectors were already in Iraq driving around in white vans! He said they had WMD's when Hans Blix reported that he hadn't found any. His ****ing story of why he attacked changed weekly and the Downing Street Memo's showed he planned this entire ruse to fool the American people. The evidence is so overwhelming and can't see how you cannot see this. Dude, that is whack!

  2. #72
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Billo_Really View Post
    I've already proven beyond a shadow of a doubt Bush lied about the Iraqi threat, yet you still spew out this bull****. Bush said Hussein wouldn't allow inspectors back into Iraq. He said this while inspectors were already in Iraq driving around in white vans! He said they had WMD's when Hans Blix reported that he hadn't found any. His ****ing story of why he attacked changed weekly and the Downing Street Memo's showed he planned this entire ruse to fool the American people. The evidence is so overwhelming and can't see how you cannot see this. Dude, that is whack!
    Please cite your incontrovertible proof, I'd like to read and critique it. I look forward to it.

  3. #73
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by cheat3 View Post
    Please do some research, The CIA paied for, organized, trained, and equiped the backbone of modern day 'Islamic extremeist' groups especially through the ISI (the inteligence arm of the ISLAMIC republic of Pakistan, who your government gives millions of $s in military aid to every year).

    If you cannot see when your government and corporate media are constructing a threat to take away your liberties you should not be reading at all, let alone the hate filled, fear mongering tripe/anciend history that you posted as you 'reading list'.

    Please go and read the US PATRIOT act and ask yourself who is the biggest threat to your constitution, 2000 year old marauding arab armies in Europe, or a government that has legally trashed the document of your founding fathers.
    Sources please!

    I do find your lack of comprehension amusing, but only because I am too tired to work up annoyance.

    What you think of as items of "Ancient History" are in the Muslim World current affairs. If you fail to grasp this extremely basic fact of Islamic Militancy, then your positions are not to be taken seriously.

    Normally, I would cite sources for you. But since you seem to reject what I have already posted, I fear that there is little point.

    But to take a stab at your question, the greatest threat to the Constitution of this, or indeed any Republic, is an ignorant population of state-dependent persons who fail to exercise analytical thinking or accept the hard truths that a must be assimilated by individuals wishing to develop a mature character.

    Such individuals have allowed themselves to become serfs, and await the coming of their masters.

    Carry on.
    Last edited by Oftencold; 12-22-08 at 05:50 AM.

  4. #74
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Many of the leading republican need to be prosecuted for war crimes.

    Bush, Chaney, Rove, are some of the worst. They were down right
    anti-american.

    We prosecuted Saddam, and Bush is far worse than him.

  5. #75
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Billo_Really View Post
    We're not talking about Hussein. We're talking about Bush/Cheney and their crimes of aggression:
    • Illegally attacking a country in violation of Article 51 of the UN Charter.
    • Bombing hospitals, power plants, water treatment facilities and other Iraqi infrastructure.
    • Using cluster bombs in urban areas, WP in Fallujah and spewing depleted uranium munitions all over the country.
    • Forcing a puppet government to write a constitution during a time of war.
    • Abuses at Abu Ghraib
    • Abuses at GITMO
    • The practice of renditions.
    • Incarcerating people for years without charges.
    • Torture.
    • Completely destroying a nation that never attacked yours for the same reason a dog licks' its balls!
    I'm not talking about Hussein.

    I'm talking about the assholes you elected!
    Im not American, If I were I wouldnt have voted for any republican nominee in my lifetime, Im not disagreeing with you.

    Im not saying it SHOULDNT happen.
    Im saying it WONT.
    The U.S does not recognise the juristiction of international courts over its citizens, and it is not going to break this precedant to have a former president arrested at this stage.
    An international war crimes trial would require the seizure of inditees by force by an external power.

    Which would likely be seen as an act of war aggainst the united states.

    No one is going to take the risk. As much as it pains me to say it.
    It is not going to happen.

    Thats why I wana see them hung for treeson. Just like they hit capone with tax evasion. When the ideal isnt possible, you catch them for what you can.
    Last edited by Real Talk; 12-22-08 at 07:58 AM.

  6. #76
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by MachuPicchu View Post
    Calls are getting more, not less, obvious in the public spectrum. So the question is, will we see prosecutions of public officials and are they justified?

    To me, it is not a left vs right issue. This isn't just about Bush/Cheney. It is an issue of the highest ethical implications. It is not about revenge, it is about justice. Our public leaders must be held responsible for criminal actions. We must set a precedent that politicians are not above the law, regardless of their motivations.

    It no longer is a fringe position to hold that we need to bring this to court and systematically determine if people committed war crimes. It is now a fringe position to ignore the overwhelming evidence that crimes very likely were committed.
    Politicians aren't accountable, but corrupt just like the system. They will never see justice..
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

  7. #77
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    If you truley desire for presidents of the U.S. to be held accountable to international law, you must crusade for the anknowlegement of the relevant international courts juristiction within the U.S.

    Sadly, I think this will be an uphill battle. As all presidential aspirants know that were they to acknowlege it that they will then become accountable to these courts themselves. I do not think that the elites of either major party will open themselves to this without SUBSTANTIAL preasure being put upon them.

    And this is not excuses for wrong doings. I am not speaking of morality in this post at all. I am saing that if you want to see presidents held accountable to the world for their actions on the world stage, this is the only avenue through which I think it is achievable. And to be honest, as far as international courts go, it is probably to late for george bush. In my opinion, if we do see him appear before an international court, he will likely be an old man.

    Real talk, not barbaric war monger apologism.





    p.s. I saw a film on a simmilar topic called "the trial of tony blaire".
    It is a dramatic film about tony blaire being fed to the wolves.
    It is very funny. He cant believe its hapening. His conversation with hillary clinton (the now president of the u.s. in the film) is priceless
    Last edited by Real Talk; 12-22-08 at 08:07 AM.

  8. #78
    Klattu Verata Nicto
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by Real Talk View Post
    If you truley desire for presidents of the U.S. to be held accountable to international law, you must crusade for the anknowlegement of the relevant international courts juristiction within the U.S.
    The international court does not and never should have jurisdiction in the U.S. we are a sovereign nation. Why would you want other countries having a say in our laws?

    Sadly, I think this will be an uphill battle. As all presidential aspirants know that were they to acknowlege it that they will then become accountable to these courts themselves. I do not think that the elites of either major party will open themselves to this without SUBSTANTIAL preasure being put upon them.
    We will handle our own business in-house, thank you very much, but we will wait until actual crimes are committed if that's alright with you.

    And this is not excuses for wrong doings. I am not speaking of morality in this post at all. I am saing that if you want to see presidents held accountable to the world for their actions on the world stage, this is the only avenue through which I think it is achievable. And to be honest, as far as international courts go, it is probably to late for george bush. In my opinion, if we do see him appear before an international court, he will likely be an old man.
    F the world and their opinions when it comes down to our sovereign law, our constitution, and our self-defense. Our business, our law, our problem.

    Real talk, not barbaric war monger apologism.
    What's barbaric about self-defense?
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  9. #79
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by dragonslayer View Post
    Many of the leading republican need to be prosecuted for war crimes.
    Okay, which one's? And how do you back that up?

    Bush, Chaney, Rove, are some of the worst. They were down right
    anti-american.
    Really, then what is American about those who have done NOTHING but stand in the way?

    We prosecuted Saddam, and Bush is far worse than him.
    How so?
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  10. #80
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by MachuPicchu View Post
    Really? This seems like an ignorant claim. Just because I didn't outline the details for you doesn't mean I'm not familiar with them. Lack of evidence is not evidence of lacking.


    Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, and many within the Pentagon (to name a few) had sufficient evidence from the CIA to show that their justification for going to war was faulty. They manipulated and misconstrued the evidence and presented to the public information they knew to be highly suspect at best to bring our country to war.

    Fiasco is an excellent overview of what occurred. Vincent Bugliosi presents an excellent case for prosecution of Bush for murder. Although it is an extreme goal, it could easily be used for war crimes as well.

    Cheney has also admitted to authorizing water boarding. Water boarding is - by any conventional definition of the word - torture. We are signatories of the Geneva Convention which prohibits all forms of torture and under international law is considered a war crime. Therefore Cheney has admitted to authorizing warcrimes.


    Violation of human rights under the Geneva Convention including, but not limited to torture and/or inhumane treatment (waterboarding), depriving a prisoner of war of a fair trial (GITMO), and unlawful deportation (Extraordinary rendition).

    These are not "might be guilty", these are things we've admitted to doing. These are things the rest of the world views as crimes. It's not a matter of if they've committed war crimes, it a matter of whether we as a country have the balls to pursuit justice. It's a matter of identifying who had a role, and who should be held accountable.
    Unless your trial happens here, it's meaningless -- and its not going happen here, so...

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