View Poll Results: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

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  • Yes we will see them and they are justified.

    5 7.81%
  • Yes we will see them but they will not be justified.

    4 6.25%
  • No we will not see them but they would have been justified.

    21 32.81%
  • No we will not see them and they would not have been justified.

    34 53.13%
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Thread: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

  1. #51
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Billo_Really View Post
    Your argument doesn't wash. Because the purpose of a war crimes trial is not to kill Iraqis. The purpose of the trial is because we killed Iraqis. So by your definition, if we are the winners, we'd be putting them (the losers) on trial. We're not. And if we ever did go to trial, it would be the winners who are charged. And the charges would be over torture, not genocide. Or do you think its okay to torture people?
    Dog.
    Sadams already dead.
    Your example blows.
    He went down for crimes, cause he lost.
    Lets keep it real here.

    Homie is not saying that thats how it SHOULD work. Hes sayin its how it DOES.
    Think stalin woulda gone out a free man to natural causes if hed lost a war to the U.S?
    2 words. **** no.
    The losers pay. The winners keep on playin. Till they lose or they die.

  2. #52
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    I would point out that modern war crimes trials are prosecuted by the UN and are international in character.
    IF your nation extrodites you. Which they dont do if they dont want you to get prosecuted.

    U know hwo many Israeli's we'd see on the stand if it were truley international?
    If your cursious, just check U.N general assembly motions condemining israeli atrocties. In an international system, ariel sharon for example, would have died in jail.
    Last edited by Real Talk; 12-21-08 at 07:46 AM.

  3. #53
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    No law is worth more than the ability to enforce it. Our President will never face trial for war crimes, and no US citizen will face trial for war crimes without our consent.

    At least as far as the United States is concerned, "international law" is not worth the paper that it is printed upon.
    What in the world makes you think an international body needs our consent to prosecute one of our citizens? If a trial went all the way through to a conviction and the international community was galvanized together and the majority of U.S. citizens agreed with it, which they would, then our government would indeed give up the treasonist liar.
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

  4. #54
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    We won't see any prosecutions. War crimes prosecutions are for countries that lose wars on their home turf, and they're nothing more than a means for victorious countries to install more pliable governments once they're ready to withdraw.

    Noone's going to win a war on American soil in the immediate futureThe Japanese, now the Chinese governments have been winning an economic "war" for some time; soon GM, Ford will be history, as they have never learned to respect the comsumer.., and both Bush and Cheney are probably going to be dead in their graves before it ever happens.
    War is a crime upon mankind..How many more tens of millions must die before man see this ???
    Bush and Cheney have neither the intellect nor morals to see this..
    To prosecute anyone will not solve anything...there is no solution other than time and far greater knowledge.

  5. #55
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Real Talk View Post
    Dog.
    Sadams already dead.
    Your example blows.
    He went down for crimes, cause he lost.
    Lets keep it real here.

    Homie is not saying that thats how it SHOULD work. Hes sayin its how it DOES.
    Think stalin woulda gone out a free man to natural causes if hed lost a war to the U.S?
    2 words. **** no.
    The losers pay. The winners keep on playin. Till they lose or they die.
    We're not talking about Hussein. We're talking about Bush/Cheney and their crimes of aggression:
    • Illegally attacking a country in violation of Article 51 of the UN Charter.
    • Bombing hospitals, power plants, water treatment facilities and other Iraqi infrastructure.
    • Using cluster bombs in urban areas, WP in Fallujah and spewing depleted uranium munitions all over the country.
    • Forcing a puppet government to write a constitution during a time of war.
    • Abuses at Abu Ghraib
    • Abuses at GITMO
    • The practice of renditions.
    • Incarcerating people for years without charges.
    • Torture.
    • Completely destroying a nation that never attacked yours for the same reason a dog licks' its balls!
    I'm not talking about Hussein.

    I'm talking about the assholes you elected!

  6. #56
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    War is a crime upon mankind..How many more tens of millions must die before man see this ???
    Bush and Cheney have neither the intellect nor morals to see this..
    To prosecute anyone will not solve anything...there is no solution other than time and far greater knowledge.
    Oh? Is this always true? What about defensive wars? Wars to liberate enslaved people? Wars to prevent even greater wars?

    How do you propose to oppose profound evil, if not by war? Or do you?

  7. #57
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    For what possible Earthly reason, since they are in fact not the same at all?
    You're right, Christian evangelical's are more of a threat to this country than radical Islam. But maybe that will change when muslims get their own lobby groups like AIPAC.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    This is, to my mind, a very peculiar position indeed. To illustrate, I oppose slavery in all its forms. But I would not equate the practice of slavery in "Virginia" in 1850, with the practice of slavery in a "Ancient Persia". I can opposes both institutions, but I would have certain problems in moral judgment if I held the same opinion of both.
    I oppose slavery in all forms. I oppose it in Virginia and Ancient Persia. Subjugating people is wrong no matter what part of history you live in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Religions vastly differ from each other, and command different responses from the religious and the irreligious. And unless you are out of touch with objective reality, which hopefully you are not, you must know this.
    This isn't a disussion on the differences of various religions, it is a discussion on threats to this country and if our elected leaders acted in self defense or as an act of aggession. And attacking a country that did not attack you first, is aggression. Therefore, war crimes have been committed and my views on religion have nothing to do with that. But you trying to make a case that it does, is simply ridiculous fear-mongering.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    You can even test your awareness. Which case in each of these pairs would surprise you more:
    Go for it!
    1. a Catholic Cardinal calling for the eradication of a non-Catholic state, by violence if necessary.
    2. an Islamic Imam calling for the eradication of a non-Islamic state, by violence if necessary.
    Both are whack! I don't listen to religious leaders in regards to political issues, just on issues of faith. That's their area of expertise. Not foreign policy.

    1. a Jewish youth blowing himself up with an explosive belt in a crowded restaurant of Buddhists because he thinks this will get him into paradise.
    2. a Muslim youth blowing himself up with an explosive belt in a crowded restaurant of Hindus because he thinks this will get him into paradise.
    That cannot possibly happen because Israel doesn't have 700 virgins!
    1. A Jehovah's Witness posting a video in which he slowly cuts off the head of a telephone repairman of foreign origin who came into his neighborhood.
    2. A Muhammadan posting a video in which he slowly cuts of the head off a telephone repairman of foreign origin who came into his neighborhood.

    Both the Jehovah and Muhammadan should be locked up for the rest of their lives with no possibility of parole.
    Feel free to keep the results of this little test private, it you don't wish to post the honest results.
    Why keep it "private"? Ask and you shall recieve. I'm not shy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Again, your ecumenicism is is ill advised. As I have state before, it behooves you to make at least some small study of the tenants of mainstream and militant Islam, before declaring them harmless.
    When did I declare anyone harmless? And who is this "them" people? You think muslims are all one entity with one common goal and act all in unison with each other? You don't think there is disagreement within the ME over certain issues with the west? Or how about this one, you don't think they have a right to be angry at us for bombing the **** out of them for the last 13 years?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    You assessment that people who disagree with you are mentally disturbed is an example of the typical leftist mindset that equates heightened emotion with rational argument.
    My assessment was directed at the holier than thou way you debate. Do you really think your perspective is the right way to look at this situation? Or the only way? And what makes you think your argument is rational? Broadstroking an entire culture as being bad, just because they refer to God with a different name, is pretty irrational to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    I do agree that you should not fear me. I am the one trying to present to you a rational, knowledge based position. Reason is not to feared, nor are reasonable people. (In more enlightened times, they are to be emulated.)
    You are not presenting an argument at all. You are spending most of your time trying to make it seem that I am difficient in some way because I don't want to study religion any further than I already have. And quite frankly, it is pretty arrogant to speak as though my "emotions" are "heightened" or irrational just because I don't buy into your argument. You need to look at your own views and ask yourself, "Is a fanatical fringe group of another religion justification to kill over 1 million men, women and children in another country?"

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    I find it very difficult to make a rational response to a position based upon willful blindness. Traditional Islam is a threat to the precepts of Western Civilization. This is a simple fact, whether one has the courage to address the issue, or retreat into comforting denials.
    I could make the same case of "Western Civilization" being a threat to "Traditional Islam". After all, we're the ones who started bombing first. We started ****ing with them, before they started ****ing with us.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    The time may come in your lifetime when you'll have to take a stand and choose a side. It is interesting to wonder what you would do in such a situation.
    I will "take a stand" and fight anyone that is a threat to my country. And that goes for any significant military that would invade us or any whacked out preacher that wants to persuade militism or any dumbass, anti-American, neocon terrorist that happens to get into my government and destroy my Constitution (or true American values).
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Very, very good! Perhaps anger will motivate study. This could be a turning point.
    Again with the personal attacks. What makes you think that I haven't studied?
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    I'm not actually terribly arrogant, but I am addressing facts, which are perhaps the most arrogant things in Creation. I do appreciate being thought of as a classic, however.
    Your welcome!
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    As for me "knowing," well to be frank, this is the state of mind one enters into when one has spent some time and effort learning facts. I advise everyone to try it.
    Again, why do keep insisting that I haven't? And a "fact" is nothing more than an "agreement" between two people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    To be perfectly honest, I have grown very tired of modern liberal thought that seem to believe that denial makes truth, emotional assertion makes fact, and a shallow pronouncement of moral relativism evokes a strong character.
    I'm getting deja vu here. Didn't you already say this above?
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Now once again, if you are serious about making relevant and well founded statements on subjects such as these, I direct you first to a study of the Koran and Hadith, and the principles of traditional Islam, and certainly the pronouncements of leading militant Muslim clerics which guide the Islamic faithful.
    I don't have to study the specific differences of the various religions. They are not a threat to this country. You're more of a threat than they are! You're trying to say the Bush Doctrine is justified because of another cultures fanatics. I'm saying that every culture has fanatics and that they are a police issue, not a national security one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    I would expect that you can direct your own studies, but I can provide an elementary reading list on request.
    By all means, if you want to suggest something worth reading, I welcome all of it. I learn something new every day of my life. The more I know, the more I find out what I don't know. I'm not one of those people who put so much stock into their political views, they never admit to being wrong. I'm one of the few posters on this website who has actually come out and apologized for being wrong on a particular issue. Some around here think that is tantamount to death. I think it's just another part of life, 50% of the time.
    Last edited by Billo_Really; 12-21-08 at 05:47 PM.

  8. #58
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeDavies View Post
    All completely irrelevant. You didn't even try to counter the charge that the Iraq war broke international law. You tried to slander instead. Very telling.
    International law does not trump American constitutional war powers, so that is completely irrelevent to the discussion, the war was approved by the United States Congress, therefore it was legal, the U.N.'s opinion is worthless.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    calling for the death of the president is far past being a jerk. Grow up
    Yep, it's a Federal criminal offense.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  10. #60
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    Re: Will we see war crime prosecutions, and are they justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Real Talk View Post
    War crimes arent even nececary.
    Just treason.
    He lied to the american public to lead them to war.
    Thats treason. Nuff said.
    Death penalties all round.
    You can't prove the president lied, no-one can, so until you have something solid drop that ridiculous argument, second, it would not fall under treason or sedition under any stretch of the imagination, however, code pink, Micheal Moore, Cindy Sheehan, and many of the anti-war extremists could easily get treason charges if we got serious, and frankly, I wouldn't shed a tear if they got the death penalty.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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