View Poll Results: The primary problem with firearms

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  • Is the firearm itself

    4 6.15%
  • Is the person pulling the trigger

    61 93.85%
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Thread: Firearms - The Primary Problem

  1. #141
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Apparently some of that stuff is possible.

    Joe Arpaio - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Arpaio began to serve inmates surplus food including outdated and oxidized green bologna[13] and limited meals to twice daily. Meal costs would be reduced to 90 cents per day; as of 2007 Arpaio states that he has managed to reduce costs to 30 cents per day. Certain food items were banned from the county jail, mainly coffee (which also reduced "coffee attacks" on corrections officers), but later salt and pepper were removed from the jail (at a purported taxpayer savings of $20,000/year).

    Arpaio banned inmates from possessing "sexually explicit material" including Playboy magazine after female officers complained that inmates openly masturbated while viewing them, or harassed the officers by comparing their anatomy to the nude photos in the publications; the ban was challenged on First Amendment grounds but upheld by the U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals.[14]

    Smoking and weightlifting equipment were also banned. Entertainment was limited to G-rated movies; the cable TV system (mandated by court order)[citation needed] was blocked by Arpaio to limit viewing to those stations Arpaio deems to be "educational", mainly Animal Planet, Disney Channel, The Weather Channel, A&E, CNN, and the local government access channel.[citation needed]

    Arpaio also instituted a program for inmates to study while in jail and to try to recover from drug abuse. Hard Knocks High lays claim as the only approved high school program in any American jail.[citation needed] Another jail program, called ALPHA, is aimed solely at getting inmates away from drug abuse.

    In October 2005, Arpaio started mandatory two-week English classes for non-English-speaking inmates at his jails. Classes last two hours a day. The curriculum comprises the three branches of government, how a bill becomes law, state government, law enforcement and court services, and jailhouse "situational" terminology. At the end of the two-week course, inmates are required to take a test to see how well they have learned about American government, the words to God Bless America, and the communication of health and safety needs. In response to critics, Arpaio responded, "These inmates happen to be incarcerated in the United States of America and in Maricopa County where I run the jails. We speak English here, not foreign languages."

    In February 2007, Arpaio instituted an in-house radio station he calls KJOE.[15] Arpaio's radio station broadcasts classical music, opera, Frank Sinatra hits, obscenity-free patriotic music, and educational programming, from the basement of the county jail, and operates five days a week, four hours each day.

    In March 2007, the Maricopa County Jail hosted "Inmate Idol"[16], a takeoff on the popular TV show.

    [edit] Tent City

    Arpaio set up a "Tent City" as an extension of the Maricopa County Jail ( [show location on an interactive map] 3325′40″N 11207′26″W / 33.42778, -112.12389 (Maricopa County Jail)). Many prisons and jails throughout the United States have used, and continue to use, tents to house inmates.[17] Tent City is located in a yard next to a more permanent structure containing toilets, showers, an area for meals, and a day room.[18] It has become notable particularly because of Phoenix's extreme temperatures. Daytime temperatures inside the tents have been reported as high as 150 degrees in the top bunks.[19] During the summer, fans and water are supplied in the tents.[20]

    When Arpaio took office, inmates were routinely being released early due to overcrowding. Arpaio believed that "courts, not head count" should determine when an inmate is released, and that no officer should be deterred from making an arrest for fear that the inmate would be released due to jail overcrowding.

    However, a new jail would have cost Maricopa County taxpayers around US$70 million. So instead, Arpaio obtained surplus tents from the military, and established Tent City in a yard adjacent to one of the jail facilities. As an announcement to future inmates that they should not expect early release upon overcrowding, but more tents instead, Arpaio added a (pink neon) "Vacancy" sign to the outside of Tent City. The original sign was destroyed in an inmate riot, but was quickly replaced. A second Tent City was opened in 1996 adjacent to another jail facility, and houses female inmates.

    According to former Sheriff's Office employees, Arpaio emptied an entire floor of one jail to help fill the tent city when it was opened. [21]

    During the summer of 2003, when outside temperatures exceeded 110 F (43 C), which is higher than average, Arpaio said to complaining inmates, "It's 120 degrees in Iraq and the soldiers are living in tents and they didn't commit any crimes, so shut your mouths."[22] Inmates were given permission to wear only their pink underwear.

    Tent City has been criticized by groups contending these are violations of human and constitutional rights, as well as by Erwin James, a journalist for The Guardian currently on parole from a life sentence in Britain,[23] but has been simultaneously praised by those favoring Arpaio's "get tough on crime" approach[who?].

    In response to requests, the Sheriff's office offers group tours of Tent City. In addition, Arpaio has instituted SMART (Shocking Mainstream Adolescents into Resisting Temptation) tents, a voluntary program for middle-school students who are bussed to an area adjacent to Tent City and, for the next 24 hours, shown the reality of jail life.

    [edit] Volunteer chain gangs

    Shortly after taking office, Arpaio reinstituted chain gangs, a form of inmate labor that had been virtually eliminated in the United States. According to Arpaio, his chain gangs are not a form of punishment, but of rehabilitation.

    Jail inmates with disciplinary problems are sent to lockdown, where they are confined to a four-person cell for 23 hours a day. Once in lockdown, low-risk inmates can volunteer for unpaid work on a chain gang as a step to rejoining the general jail population. After 30 days on the chain gang, inmates are eligible to rejoin the general population. Chain gangs perform public-service tasks such as creating fire breaks, cleaning up graffiti, weeding, removing trash, and burying deceased homeless in the county cemetery. They work eight-hours a day, six days a week, mainly outside. Like the rest of the county's jail population, chain-gang members wear traditional black-and-white-striped uniforms and caps.

    Arpaio later expanded the chain gang concept by instituting female volunteer chain gangs.[24] Female inmates work seven hours a day (7 am to 2 pm), six days a week. He has also instituted the world's first all-juvenile volunteer chain gang; volunteers earn high school credit toward a diploma.[25]

    [edit] Pink underwear

    One of Arpaio's most visible public relations successes was the introduction of pink underwear, which the Maricopa County Sheriff's website cites as being "world famous."[26] Arpaio has claimed that that traditional white underwear, labeled with Maricopa County Sheriff's Office, was being smuggled out of the jails and sold on the streets, and he thus had the underwear dyed pink, believing that pink is not considered a "macho" color, and would not be stolen.

    Arpaio subsequently started to sell customized pink boxers (with the Maricopa County Sheriff's logo and "Go Joe") as a fund-raiser for Sheriff's Posse Association. Despite allegations of misuse of funds received from these sales, Arpaio declined to provide an accounting for the money [27].

    Arpaio's success in gaining press coverage with the pink underwear resulted in him extending the use of the color. He introduced pink handcuffs, using the event to promote his book, Sheriff Joe Arpaio, America's Toughest Sheriff. [28]. Later, Arpaio ordered that sheets, socks, towels, and other fabric items be dyed pink.

    [edit] Underwear march

    In 2005, nearly 700 maximum-security prisoners were marched the four blocks from Towers Jail to the newly opened Lower Buckeye Jail, wearing only their underwear and flip-flops to prevent the concealment of weapons. Prisoners were strip-searched when they left Towers Jail and again when they reached their destination.[29]

    "It's a security issue," Arpaio said. "If you let them wear their clothes, they can conceal the fake keys and everything else.[30]



    My solution is to repeal the GCA and other Acts that have anti-2nd amendment laws. Make it extremely easy for anyone to buy arms, there are vastly more honest citizens then there are criminals, a criminal will think twice before robbing someone if he knows that the citizens are armed.
    I know of Arpaio but don't you think he's the exception to the rule and not the standard? That's what I mean by implementation. There may be limited examples, like Arpaio, but making these examples the norm, nationally, is far from realistic. At least in the short term.

    I don't know. I understand the limits placed in the GCA so I'll have to give that a little more thought and study. But just to put this out there, would you agree to make a well armed citizenry a deterent to the criminal element in socidety citizens have to be enabled to be a visible deterent rather then just a 'potential' threat?

  2. #142
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueKC View Post
    That one's easy; in the UK it's tougher to shoot each other because there is gun control.
    That is new ****ing Labour for you. Unfortunately the bastards were able to take our ancient rights to bear arms. I'm not confident but I hope we'll be able to reassert them one day.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  3. #143
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by rsixing View Post
    I know of Arpaio but don't you think he's the exception to the rule and not the standard? That's what I mean by implementation. There may be limited examples, like Arpaio, but making these examples the norm, nationally, is far from realistic. At least in the short term.
    IF Joe can do it despite being in Arizona then I am sure other states can do it to.

    I don't know. I understand the limits placed in the GCA so I'll have to give that a little more thought and study.
    wikipedia has some articles on the GCA , FOPA and the brady bill.

    Gun Control Act of 1968 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Firearm Owners Protection Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia





    But just to put this out there, would you agree to make a well armed citizenry a deterent to the criminal element in socidety citizens have to be enabled to be a visible deterent rather then just a 'potential' threat?
    Yes I agree that a well armed citizenry is a deterrent against the criminal element. I also believe it is a deterrent against a corrupt government as well.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  4. #144
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    I am an active gun owner, and I love it. yet i think of all the lives that would be saved yearly if there were no guns. People are the problem, but no guns would save thousands of live annually.

  5. #145
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    When Sir Robert Peel introduced the police force to London it was openly said by many that a half dozen slit throats a year in Whitechapel was a small price to pay for the opportunity for state tyranny this new system represented not being there.

    I think that is well worth remembering here.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  6. #146
    Another day in paradise..
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by dragonslayer View Post
    I am an active gun owner, and I love it. yet i think of all the lives that would be saved yearly if there were no guns. People are the problem, but no guns would save thousands of live annually.




    Wow. Cancer, buckets, ladders, cars, etc... What a brave new world!


    Matthew 10:34
    Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

  7. #147
    Matthew 16:3
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Sometimes I think about all the lives that would be saved if there were no people and then my head starts to hurt.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  8. #148
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Sometimes I think about all the lives that would be saved if there were no people and then my head starts to hurt.
    If no one is born, then no on dies.
    Thus, ban birth.

  9. #149
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    If no one is born, then no on dies.
    Thus, ban birth.
    Makes sense.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  10. #150
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    Re: Firearms - The Primary Problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Makes sense.
    Oh, and ban forks. They cause obesity, like guns cause crime.

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