View Poll Results: Do you have a right to NOT join a union

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    100 89.29%
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Thread: A right to NOT join a union?

  1. #111
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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Seeing how the unions do not own the companies the answer should be no regardless of the state. Unions should have no right what so ever to dictate whether or not a non-union member can perform contracted work.
    You don't need to own a company to have a legal contract with a company.

    This is a deep problem with the right wing today (they claim to be for the middle class)....They want to grant "personhood" to corporations and make the claim that corporations have the same rights granted to citizens under the Constitution..

    Well they don't. ......
    Last edited by dragondad; 08-30-09 at 07:11 PM.

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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by dragondad View Post
    You don't need to own a company to have a legal contract with a company.
    Wouldn't the company need to agree to that contract?


    This is a deep problem with the right wing today (they claim to be for the middle class)....
    Private owner ship is a totally separate issue from being for the middle class

    They want to grant "personhood" to corporations and make the claim that corporations have the same rights granted to citizens under the Constitution..
    This is about property ownership not person hood. If you do not own a company then you can not dictate hiring practices of that company. The owners of a company can write a contract out agreeing to only hire union members, but that is up to the company owners to decide that.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  3. #113
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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Wouldn't the company need to agree to that contract?


    Private owner ship is a totally separate issue from being for the middle class



    This is about property ownership not person hood. If you do not own a company then you can not dictate hiring practices of that company. The owners of a company can write a contract out agreeing to only hire union members, but that is up to the company owners to decide that.
    ALL these companies agreed to the contract...they come up for renewal on a regular basis! And if they don't like it after the contract expiration...they can lock the employees out and hire scabs.

    And the hell we can't dictate the hiring practices of that company!

    This isn't Ron Paul World. We have laws that say exactly what a Company can and cannot do in regards to their hiring practices.

    And it's all perfectly legal.....If you think not.....Tell it to the Judge.

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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Wouldn't the company need to agree to that contract?


    Private owner ship is a totally separate issue from being for the middle class



    This is about property ownership not person hood. If you do not own a company then you can not dictate hiring practices of that company. The owners of a company can write a contract out agreeing to only hire union members, but that is up to the company owners to decide that.
    In union shops is is the company that writes the contract to only hire union workers. Right to work law essentially says that the company owners cannot write this type of contract. Union shops are bargained into a legal contract with a company. Personally, I don't see why a company should not be able to sign contract that creates a union shop. Given that non-members can free-ride off of the members who do pay dues and organize a union, I can see why union members would try to bargain for a union shop agreement.

  5. #115
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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by JimboJ View Post
    In union shops is is the company that writes the contract to only hire union workers. Right to work law essentially says that the company owners cannot write this type of contract. Union shops are bargained into a legal contract with a company. Personally, I don't see why a company should not be able to sign contract that creates a union shop. Given that non-members can free-ride off of the members who do pay dues and organize a union, I can see why union members would try to bargain for a union shop agreement.
    Unions power is deeply eroded in right to work states...the effectiveness of a strike is greatly reduced because those non-union workers can keep working and not fear for their jobs....In a closed shop strike...if you continue working and the union comes back...you are out of a job.

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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by dragondad View Post
    ALL these companies agreed to the contract...they come up for renewal on a regular basis! And if they don't like it after the contract expiration...they can lock the employees out and hire scabs.
    So what are we in disagreement about? The company owners are the ones allowing this not the unions.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by dragondad View Post
    Sweden in 85% unionized and has one of the highest standards of living in the World...above that of the USA. (who scores high with the help our huge wealth of natrural resources)
    Thank you for connecting 2 things that have almost nothing to do with each other.

    How about using statistics that actually can be influenced by unionization, such as employment rates and productivity?

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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    Quote Originally Posted by dragondad View Post
    Sweden in 85% unionized and has one of the highest standards of living in the World...above that of the USA. (who scores high with the help our huge wealth of natrural resources)
    You're confusing correlation with causation, there's no indication that being in a union makes the country have a high standard of living, only that the two elements exist in the same country.

    So when people tell you unions make things worth ...that's pure right wing B.S.
    As opposed to the pure left wing B.S. that you're spouting?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    The 1937 Taft/Hearty act make's it a federal crime to have a closed shop or force anyone to join a union in this country.

  10. #120
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    Re: A right to NOT join a union?

    There used to be a time and place for unions but those days are over. Now they are simply evil and may as well be the Mafia!
    ~Following My Own Flow~

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